It’s astounding, how wrong we be about things and people. With Jupiter in Capricorn, know-it-alls will be humbled. I wrote this with Saturn in Sagittarius, which is the same sort of energy. The problem we have with this has gotten much worse, from what I can see.
Here’s the original post.
I was working on the Saturn in Sagittarius workshop. I realized there had come a day when I became aware that I was pretty much wrong about everything. This happens with age, I guess. You’re sure you have something figured out, then something happens and you realize you were completely misguided if not flat-out delusional.
In other cases, you may have been sort of right.
Or maybe you were right, but missing so much of the nuance or the bigger picture, your “rightness” was marginal.
So marginal, you have to be mighty generous with yourself to take credit for your tiny, shrimpy, rightness.
I’ll give you an example of some of my wrongness…because it’s just so vast and pervasive…
I thought that no one lied in court, ever.
I thought I would be with the boy who gave me my first piece of jewelry, forever.
I thought no one should need a gun to protect themselves.
I thought I would never make it to 16, 25, 35, etc.
After 25 years, I thought, Leon and I would be friends forever.
I didn’t think someone who killed himself was going to kill himself.
I didn’t think I would ever become an astrologer.
I didn’t think a man would ever truly, love me. That I would find my “soulmate” as they say.
I thought “peace, love and understanding” was all the world needed.
I thought Keith Richards would be dead by now.
I thought I didn’t want to get married…ever!
I could go on and on and on.
There are some things I was right about but I can’t think of any of them right now. Are you sure that what you think is right, is actually right? How do you feel about the prospect of finding out you were wrong…about pretty much everything?
I like to keep the future open with possibilities. I have suspicions about what will happen but I’m open to being proved wrong.
For example, I don’t expect that I will ever get married or have any children, but I admit that I don’t know that for sure. It might happen. I’m just not counting on it.
“I thought Keith Richards would be dead by now.”
Me too!! ???
Is this what Saturn in Sag is about? This is exactly what I’m going through right now. I thought I had the future predicted. Wrong.
Some things I had envisioned for myself actually belong to someone else now. I don’t like Saturn. I really don’t know why we need him. At least I’m no longer mentally tormented since Saturn left Scorp, but now I have no vision for the future. I think I’m going to sign up for the Saturn in Sag class.
So much so that I’ve stopped expecting anything about what would happen this day, next year. I’d just figure out on my way.
Reasonable guesses as good as it gets. The Buddha said this a long, long time ago.
Interesting take on Saturn in Sag. I have learned long ago to not trust anyone or anything to be 100% true. When I was a child, I believed everything on TV to be true. Haha! My parents would buy me toys and I would end up disappointed because they were nothing like what I saw on TV. Little things like this, helped me to realize that that old saying, “Believe half of what you see and nothing of what you hear” is so true.
And I agree, I thought Keith Richards would be long dead. Lol! Of course, there are times when I say something like this and said person ends up dead.
Not too much really shocks me anymore. It seems that anytime I think something is true, I find out the opposite is true.
I used to sit and stare at a glass of milk waiting for it to turn into a Milky Way bar. Also, I wanted my mom to buy Imperial Margarine, because I wanted to eat it and have a crown appear on my head. Lol.
LOL…that is so cute and funny! I remember those Imperial margarine commercials…But I didn’t understand the margerine and crown connection…I did think it meant that family might be special though!…lol
After I survived from Saturn teaching while its visit to Leo, Virgo, Libra and Scorpio, I have learned, nothing is mine and anything can be happen any time. I do not expect anything and I have to sacrifice everything.
lol@Keith Richards. I saw his biography featured on netflix too. I might even look into to see what it’s about. 😀
He did look nearly dead, twenty years ago. He looks pretty good now. 🙂
It’s all those fresh blood transfusions earlier on..lol .long walks, whiskey, cigarettes and optimism. He is also very well read. Oh and I am sure his lovely wife a Patty keeps him young. I too thought he’d be dead by now.
Thanks for that, Elsa….it made me laugh….. I was just using Keith as an example of “ya never know; your good fortune” yesterday.
I tell you what, as a person with Mars in Leo, it has been hard to admit I’m wrong through the years. Somewhere along the line I figured out, maybe by watching obviously wrong people (like me) maintain a charade, that admitting I’m wrong is actually a virtuous thing. It gains a person respect because people appreciate that openmindedness and honesty. It’s ok to be wrong, turn around and go right.
I’m one of the Mars in Leo (8th House) Natives, and it’s true that admitting I’m wrong has been, and still is, hard for me. Saturn was conjunct Mars at birth so the lesson of admitting wrongs crops up often in my 68 years. The root of that grandiosity lies in wait for me as I dig deep for ‘more truth’ and as someone on this thread has stated, it’s in the writer’s life that I find a way to grow something from those rootlets.
Still true, but admitting and humbling gets easier when I look in the mirror and see I’m no longer young and wild; and the young have got it over me big time!
Regarding #1. Were you ten years old when you thought that? How old were you when you realized the truth?
I was 27.5 years old. It was my Saturn return. I was in stone cold shock, sitting in a courtroom, listening to my father lie.
I just thought no one would ever do such a thing. They just couldn’t lie, because they were in there swearing to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth!
I really was horrified. I was distraught, actually.
My husband has been through 3 or 4 jury trials and it was amazing how blatantly people lie.Some people just do…it seems to be easy for them. It certainly changed my perception of people.
That’s very jarring! I believed that too Elsa. I even think the truth gets slanted more often than we’d like to believe in our court system.
I used to believe that my co-workers were friends until getting stabbed in the back or scapegoated by them.
I used to believe if a guy slept with you it meant he loved you.
There’s lots more but I have Saturn in Sag and am a bit less naive than I used to be!
oh my gosh! yes!!
in a child custody case i was astounded and literally my libra sun and stellium was shattered] that no one was picking up on my husband lying his ass off.. even his brother. and when i burst out to my own lawyer who id also tried to put in her place that she would change wordings on things i said. i got told by child assessor person court isnt about truth everyone lies, the judges know that, its normal.. it did my head in, so what is the point of it all again o_O
I was talking to someone about this last night. We are drowning in so many lies, people can no longer discern the truth.
I quit talking about my life. What I say is true but unbelievable, so what’s the point?
I think it’s going to change though.
yes. i hear you Elsa.
i very much feel the same, i am astounded the stuff that people talk about their lives and yet if i do so, everything i say is unbelievable to others. so i have learned not to, ive been trying to actually figure out what these silences are in my chart, as i sense some of us truly are hushed. there indeed seems some of us are just meant to roll around in it ourselves, maybe write a memoir before we are 83 😉
i hope i’m wrong on a lot of fronts…this self-doubt, pleasing other people and inhibitedness is killing me. 😐
I don’t particularly care much for ‘right or wrong’.
I know where I am on my journey and I try to meet/accept others where they are on their journey.
I don’t even bother to try to understand ‘right’, much less try to stand on my own ‘rightness’. There’s too much gray, to may what if’s, to many special exceptions, etc.
Mind your manners and treat others as you’d like to be treated have gone a long way for me,
Wow! What an epic and fascinating answer.
Kind’a of a greek tragedy. Sorry you had to go thru that. My Pisces Moon feels your pain.
I’m really glad you asked. It made me think about how each of us are individuals, from our era and circumstances. I really thought that court was a solemn thing. You solemnly swear. I just didn’t know there was anyone anywhere who would put their hand on a bible, swear to God, and then not feel bound to follow through.
I understand this is ludicrous at this point…but my soul still feels it’s very serious.
I think it’s serious too.
I can say this about saturn in sag. I am not sure of the exact date saturn progressed to sag. And then natal pluto, neptune, sun and nodes all progressed at that same time too. So hard sayin exactly what. But it was somewhere around there, hate to go back to the past, it’s so over, but anyway certain information was revealed. Whoa! Say what? I knew something was up with the situation back when pluto was at the end of scorpio conjunct natal saturn and uranus and neptune were in saturn ruled cap. I was aware something was up, but yegads, I never would have guessed. So it’s not like I felt like I knew this or that, but information that was revealed clarified the politic I was experiencing. I know this probably sounds cryptic but it is way complicated. If I could write, I’d do the novel. But alas, I am not, so the story shall die with me.
I’ve been wrong about almost everything in my life but I didn’t have that one major moment where I realized that it was all a bunch of shit. It has mostly been on a event-by-event basis. The lying thing is interesting because I think if you’re the kind of person who doesn’t lie, you just assume others don’t as well. I was finally faced with the reality of a close friend who turned out to be a pathological liar and, as you said, it is very shocking to realize that someone you trusted has been lying all the time. It’s a very strange feeling to have, and the betrayal is deep. Other things that I never thought would happen: I never thought I would be fat. I am. I never thought I’d be single for my entire life. I have been. I also never thought I would live very long. In my head, I had my death at age 55, however, I’m now 65, so I’m just leaving it up to the Universe. I try not to assume too much at this stage in my life, especially since I’ve been pretty much wrong about everything. I’m just gonna go with the flow. Planning is just not for me. I can’t be bothered anymore.
Last sentence : ditto with preaching
“I was finally faced with the reality of a close friend who turned out to be a pathological liar and, as you said, it is very shocking to realize that someone you trusted has been lying all the time. It’s a very strange feeling to have, and the betrayal is deep.”
This happened to me and yes it is a deep betrayal and so very painful…
I just had the same thing happen to me. After 5 years of deep friendship. The loss has changed my level of trust completely.
if nothing is permanent, everything that is true will eventually become false? just work with what you got…?
From what I read here many people had specific ideas “before”.
I get the impression that I’ve never had very precise ideas about many things, but as it turns out, I’m STILL surprised at some outcomes, whether for me, or for people around me. (Plus the things that no-one can possibly predict like 9/11 or Katrina)
Aside from that, I find it reassuring to know that a person can be wrong, and get over it. There are things to be learned from mistakes. Another good idea is to forgive one’s self for these mistakes.
I also thought that people don’t lie (not being a very accomplished liar myself), but boy when you find out that this is possible, it is quite a shock. I felt so naïve, and I was no longer a child…
The reason this is important is 30 years ago, one person could believe one thing, another something else and it was not big deal. But now people burn people to the ground due to not agreeing with them…and if you’re standing on a platform that you find out is WRONG, down the road, and you have persecuted people over your wrong belief or misunderstanding of something, it’s going to be mighty painful.
That’s so true Elsa. It used to be ok to have a different opinion and respectfully remain friends.
y’know, some people, young and old lie as a “strategy”, years ago, me and my gf knew this girl in our creative/artistic circle who would mope and whine she was super poor, and gave off the impression that she was living in a poor shack, or small home cramped with lack of food, their electricity was going to shut off. She hardly invited anyone to her home, and one time my gf went to her house, because she was moving to another big home lol And found her house to be like a mansion, with an indoor pool heated, sauna, and lots of rooms. So, the next time we heard her complaining it was when she was going to a 3rd world country with her family and was whining of no electricity, lack of food, ect. (her family owns a big business in europe) we just go, well, it explains why she has alot of friends catering to her. lol *shrug* whatcha gonna do?
I began lying around age 8. I was one of 9 children and we were extremely poor and my parents, in a sincere attempt to offer my brother and I (the youngest two and last at home) moved into a ruin of a house in an upscale neighborhood. My friends were all 8 year-olds too so when they said how things were at their house I went along and claimed those things as mine and they just thought sure. My brother was 12 and today would be considered a fascinating nerd but then he was shunned and it was painful to watch. I thought this will happen to me. By 11 I shoplifted nice underwear so that no one would point fingers at me in the gym locker room. My mother sewed my clothes and would get hand-me-downs from cousins and alter them to fit me. Now I know how creative and industrious she was but then I was embarrassed and would lie and say we got them in Atlanta. By the time I was in middle school I was what I was afraid of…the girl to be pitied. But I was considered pretty and started using that but my background as a liar made me distrustful of others honesty. Anyway, its been a piece of my personality and life. At some point I hate the lies and fess up and some stay and some don’t. Mostly I lie now by omition (still a sin, I know). I can’t speak for everyone but some people lie because they don’t believe the real person would be cared for.
The only plus I have to offer to this negative trait is that I am a writer…story telling is a land I live in.
Wila, that last line says it for me, too.
The purity of writing this I would put up to many a righteous never spin a yarn truth teller. Highly creative mind I opine. Any enlightened court of law would see it this way.
I think my illusions are pretty much shattered upon contact. I try to keep a little bit of hope inside for humanity but mostly I think it’s all crap. I don’t see a lot of virtue in people and never have. Maybe that’s where I am actually wrong? I’d love to be proven wrong on this matter. The state of my soul depends on it.
That’s interesting. I see virtue in a lot of people. Most people, actually.
Me too elsa. Or maybe I simply understand why people arent and cut them some slack.
I think virtue and vice can bith exist in a person.
I agree Tango – my husband is a perfect example. He’s Sun and Moon in Pisces.
I still feel like this a few years later, but have some more clarity on it. I mean, every once in a while someone will surprise me with their kindness and it is amazing and beautiful and appreciated. But its the rarity that makes it special.
But theres some kind of freedom in admitting that people are disappointing and life is disappointing. It sounds dark, but its not, because it just lets life be what it is. Its like completing the grieving process. Well its not like the grieving proces- it IS the grieving process, with acceptance being the final step.
I do still have a little hope for humanity, but I used to cling to that hope with desperation like I used to. Its just there as a sort of freedom. Its not my place to have expectations of life.
Basically I took the burden of trying to figure out life, off of myself. Its allowed me to see the equanimity in life. EVERYTHING IS TEMPORARY. Including my ideas.
I’m in the process of reaching that place you describe (so very well). Thank you for putting it into words.
libra noir & tango.
thankyou for your sharings, they are all so spot on for my thinkings too.. very well expressed ~*~
Well, Saturn is still in the early degrees of Sagittarius, but it hasn’t altered this cornerstone of my life so far– I have never wanted children and know down in my bones I did the right thing by not having any. Maybe Saturn only causes a change of belief or heart when it comes to convictions that are actually incorrect?
I thought me and my daughter’s father (an Aries) would never separate, especially like we did, and…
I never thought I’d meet a somewhat wealthy man and spend about ten years with him (a Capricorn). I wasn’t interested in him at all at first, but the more I got to know him, the more I fell in love with him. Actually, the 18th will be our ten year mark…whoa. Time flew.
I never thought I’d let my daughter spend an entire school year with her father in another state. That was tough.
There’s a lot of things I may be now thinking definitively that I could be so wrong about. And with some of these things, I hope I am wrong. I misplaced my diamond ring and I’m beginning to think ill never find it for instance. -.-
Thats a common for instance the final closing frustration are things at hand go bye bye but lets play gypsy for a moment I think you will find that ring.. If not already its just guilt worry let it be a separate issue.. At first you didn’t think it would be permantly lost.. Thats like life there is relief.. Hope you are reunited with it soon.
Funny coincidence the resurfacing of this post as just yesterday I was mentally reviewing all the things I have been wrong about, the last few years.
Its been crushing to see the truth about people I loved and believed in, people who I thought were actually better than me for their strong faith. I don’t know why I am like this but I will put people on a pedestal only to see them come crashing down.
See, that hits on something for me. Nothing and nobody has ever met my expectations.
But I think maybe its not lifes job to meet them (obviously), but my job to release expectations. Hard. Its essentially unconditional love…no expectations.
I have all Virgo/Pisces, this is the struggle for me. My Virgo says “not only do I know this can be done, I know it can be done BETTER” but then life isn’t like that, to the point that sometimes every day feels like a colossal joke. Releasing, reducing everything down to just what happens within is the Pisces. Knowing to know nothing.
Except in my case, this gets me to “What’s the point (of going through such days, day after day)? I can’t wait for it (my life) to be over.
Good questions. They are the ones that led me to spirituality or my spirit. Because “out there” wasnt bringing me happiness. So the only other direction I could go was in.
Then surpisingly, after some dark nights if the soul, I srarted to enjoy things again, but not depend on them for happiness. They can come and go, and that applies to sensations too, from bliss to apathy and despair, and there’s still something that is untouched by these things and always present.
Thanks Libra noir for sharing about your journey, here in this thread and elsewhere throughout this site. I get a lot from your insights.
I think I am following in your footsteps, am on the same path; am hoping (working) to get to where you’re at. I do feel a definite shift within me, and it is a constructive one. (Just having a ‘dip’ at the moment. I’ll pick up again.)
Im humbled by that, thank you.
Its a Neptune thing
I think an experience like this could be interesting, now. I don’t know what’s true. With Jupiter in Sagittarius, it may be a more “fun” thing. Honestly, I’m hoping for some good comedy. Do you think some funny comedians will come out of this?
I am not firey and my favorite comedians are all Capricorn moons. They’ve done some tremendous comedy with difficult placements in earth and water these past couple years.
I didnt need Sagitarius to wake me up.
The retrograde in Venus Scorpio and Scorpio Jupiter did that.
Im rather tired of lessons. This Scorpio year was one of most tumultuous and excruciating experiences I have ever been through.Im hoping to be treated with kid gloves this next year when it comes to love. I feel if I get knocked around any more I run a chance of becoming quite bitter.
No way anyone, a human being, can know everything. Add in free will, and chaos sometimes comes! If I were to predict something, I would have to at least read books, etc, etc. And then add in curve balls, and it hurts my head!
Too complicated, too complicated.
At one time, I didn’t think everything in the mainstream media was propaganda…..what an idiot I was!
I just had a Jupiter return at 23′ Scorpio and nothing important occurred at all. I’m hoping with Jupiter in Sag, it will hit my moon at 4′ in a joyful way being in the 9th house.
One of my closest cohorts has a Sag Jupiter has said on occasion that she is not allowed to have opinions. Everyone else gets to have opinions but she doesn’t. I don’t respond when she spouts this. I venture to guess that she thinks that everything she thinks and says is a fact. Imagine that. Don’t get me wrong, we are life long friends and I love her. It’s just one of her quirks.
Moving to the PNW slapped the shit outta me with truth. I needed it.
Now I befriend mysteries. Not everything has an answer, not everything has ONE ABSOLUTE answer.
To be humbled has opened the world to me. Everywhere I go, my heart and mind is open to WHAT IS, and what it should or ought to be. People show me love and are vulnerable with me without prompt. It’s beautiful.
Keith Richards, LOL.
Although it can be shocking to discover what you thought was not accurate; it is far better to live enlightened and in truth, even if that hurts a bit.
In the 60s and 70s, there was a surreal hippy comedy troupe called ‘The Firesign Theatre’. They had an album out in 1974 entitled ‘Everything You Know is Wrong’ – which became a popular catchphrase. This phrase has stayed with me since that time, and as I grow older, I have come to savour its wisdom. The more I learn, the more I realise what I don’t know. I think in the end that I will be reduced to the realisation that I am nobody, and I know nothing. I don’t mean that in a negative sense, but rather as a sort of ultimate realisation.
Very well said. Thank you.
I had forgotten “The Firesign Theatre” but reading it (in print like this) in a thread about being humbled through realizing everything I know to be wrong? It’s the Universe showing up, EleanorD. Part of the ultimate plan. Thanks for this flash of recall. And yes, I agree … very well said.
Yes I too duped, I believed that all
Adults should be offered respect as they offer too.Yea wrong, I thought if you put in time and put your heart in the game it result in nourishing dish
Wrong, I thought I should be an example of the gentle presence
Yeah then came the witless ego monster driving steam roller acting like a crusty pirate, yuk.time to
Try another belief.I am a good human
Bugs monsters creeps N. N. A. Need not apply
I don’t think you were wrong, per say…. I think you were right, for right then. Like never getting married, when you believed that it was based on your “right now” feelings/situation. As those things changed, so did what you believed.
I never wanted kids, I was adamant, I didn’t want them…until I did.
I thought my family would be rock solid forever…until circumstances changed. Was i wrong? Yes and no…had the circumstances not changed i would have been right..and I was right, until I wasn’t.
ha! yes, this is all so truuuee… !! >_<
and i would idolise people or job roles.. i still to this day have to check myself for idealising people and teach my children. Stop iT! they are just a human, humans are all messed up somewhere, and if you cant see it then it might be worse than normal 😉
I do the same, I believed and am to this day putting high trust and respect in people of authority, but I’ve had mistakes, some take years to see and comprehend the damage they did, I don’t trust and believe like I used to, but my tendencies to as when I was little are still there, hate it, yes do teach your children to question, consider the source, not rebel- but be informed, don’t just obey know their options and so on.
I just dont know even with doing the best possible options I knew to do, I was still wrong or that was just I was meant to.
Not only is Keith Richards not dead but he has exposed himself as a bit of a lover of history and art as well as rumor has it quit smoking. There again whether true or not is under question,always.
But his mentor in nasty image,bad boy is dead. Maybe Keith was always a beauty lover under his made to shock debauched image.
As for Keith Richards, I think he is quite the supporter and consumer of organic foods. The fact that he looks like the vertically embalmed is superfluous, lol. Remarkable that he quit smoking. I remember reading that 1 cigarette will destroy the vitamin C of an orange, so maybe some of his produce buddies got through to him.
God bless you. I grew out of the same.
Jeez I thought I always saw the big picture, it just keeps getting bigger, I’m an HSP, highly intuitive, mildly clairsentient, very bright, so for some I imagine it’s not learning they’re wrong they just learn more.
Mercury going direct, I wanted to read today, find myself communicating as well lol
I never thought I’d fail at anything.
I thought all people were generally good.
I believed in the nation, system and world we were taught in school.
And you reasonably could believe those things. But its a balance. Its not the systems, its the people who run them at the higher levels.
This is going to be a painful transition. Like you do in Yoga, you don’t resist. You inhale, exhale and stretch further…breathing into the pain. Its amazing how more flexible you become
i thought i could keep blood off of my hands. but we all have it. i just hope at least some of us keep trying to honor all that has been lost by building a better future.
I remember believing that Clarence Thomas should not be on the supreme court because I believed someone who said he had once commented that there was a ***** hair on his coke can. My Dad, a father of 6 white girls who worked for NASA in his day, and had a reputation as being racist, told me that we needed him on the court to balance it out and represent black people. I told him if he kept it up I would never speak to him again. Now, when I think I am right about something, I always think back to when I was really, really wrong, and my dad was dead right.