What Is A Vicious Woman?

A stranger once told met I was a vicious woman.  She said that I was fooling myself to think or to state otherwise.

I don’t see myself as even remotely vicious but I decided to ask my husband what he thought. This is because the remark was made in regards to something I wrote about years ago, that concerned him.

My husband feels most women are vicious. Maybe even all women are vicious. I think this view is colored by his personal experience. He’s got a Scorpio Moon. I have Jupiter Moon.

I’m talking real life here, not the internet!  The inability to look someone in the face creates all kinds of problems. But speaking of my own real-life experience, I have met very few women I could call vicious, or even “mean” women for that matter.

I am not talking about a women reacting to someone coming after her family or to steal her man. I consider those things to be extraordinarily provocative. This is where a definition of “vicious” comes into play. It turns out my husband and I are not solid on what the word means.

In my mind, a vicious woman will hunt you. She’ll try to destroy you. You, your reputation, your livelihood, your family…it’s just a full on war. Blood sport. There are no lines she won’t cross.

I will defend myself with vigor, but once you’re off my property, that’s it. I am not going to follow you home, beat up your car, toilet paper your house, set traps for you, stalk you, mess with your reputation or any other damned thing.  Matter of fact, I am going to forget you as soon as humanly possible.

I give this to Jupiter Moon. I want to move on. I want to leave bad experiences behind. This part of my character makes it hard to for me to be “vicious” as I understand it.

From Dictionary.com

1. addicted to or characterized by vice; grossly immoral; depraved; profligate: a vicious life.
2. given or readily disposed to evil: a vicious criminal.
3. reprehensible; blameworthy; wrong: a vicious deception.
4. spiteful; malicious: vicious gossip; a vicious attack.
5. unpleasantly severe: a vicious headache.
6. characterized or marred by faults or defects; faulty; unsound: vicious reasoning.
7. savage; ferocious: They all feared his vicious temper.

What do you think of this. I don’t want to hear whether you think I am vicious or not. You don’t even know me. Are you vicious? How do you define it?

Do some people attract evil as a matter of course? I have a packed 8th house.  I attract everything. Evil is in there, but it does it dominate or even show up as a pattern.

Since we’re talking about women, you’d probably want to look at the natal moon.




What Is A Vicious Woman? — 89 Comments

  1. I worked for a viscous woman and I agree with you. Once you’ve met someone that malicious, it gives you a reality check on others. There are some people that just operate more consciously or unconsciously than others, but even then that doesn’t necessarily make them cruel. This person I knew is a total sociopath, and was specifically out to get other women.

    • That’s another criteria I would use. A person who targets another person for ruin or to cause them distress or whatever. I lack the capacity to do this…as well as the interest. It’s just not my gig and this is true of most the women I meet as well.

  2. Right, I agree. Witnessing some one like her in action left me with tainted vibes for a very long time. She met basically everything you described above and then beyond. She was a plutonic Libra, and a dirty clairvoyant. She was incredibly magnetic & could mirror anything you wanted to hear.. but, anytime she was being “nice,” oh buddy, look out. She’s a real modern day witch… and not the good kind. She loved sleeping with men half her age, and hated every single woman that crossed her path. It was nasty, nasty.

  3. Besides, I don’t meet too many viscous Venus Neptune types. I have the square myself, and I’d say that was big reason I tolerated her for as long as I did.

  4. Someday I will not read ‘vicious’ as ‘viscous’. LOL! Had a bit of a double-take there. Ah, but love the opportunities for punnery!

    Viscous: having a thick, sticky consistency between solid and liquid; having a high viscosity.


  5. The truly vicious women I have known have been deep down angry and not liking their life. There were two of them that went out of their way to damage other women and neither one had any real friends because everyone knew they could not be trusted. Very sad.

  6. I’m not vicious or malicious just deelovely and delicious (groove is in the ♡). 🙂 First house Virgo moon trining Mars in Capricorn. Fiery temper, yes. I barbwire my boundaries.

  7. What is a vicious woman? Not nearly as lethal as a vicious man. Sad to hear your husband has such a generic, one side fits all approach to women. The world might attest: there are way more vicious men ‘out there’ than there are women.

    • Absolutely right. Such as belief/projection (“all women are vicious”) is an extremely limiting blind spot. We all know who gets a gun and kills their entire family or a room full of strangers. Rarely a woman.

  8. Definition number 4 is what comes to my mind when I hear the word. I’ve met a handful of women I would characterize as such. All of them face to face and with the opportunity to observe them behaving as such. I would guess this person was using a fair amount of projection, either of their own viciousness or using you as a surrogate for someone in their life who is that way.

  9. I have known at least 2 full fledge vicious women. I feel like there is a sliding scale with this stuff though. I have seen normal women go off the deep end with this stuff when a relationship went bad. I don’t know if it’s ego or having to be right or both. Not sure.

  10. Maybe the man that called you vicious is a Scorpio moon himself.
    This position is pretty difficult for men, I have witnessed their troubled relationships with women. The Scorpio moon women I know just don’t get along with women but they don’t care because they are magnets for men – the real targets.
    My definition of viciousness refers to bad behavior ingrained in subconscious/ DNA. Some people have wonderful lives and they still cheat, steal, lie and manipulate. They do it because they can’t help themselves. I call that vicious. They even due it to the ones they love because they can’t help themselves.

    • It was someone who doesn’t know me (an internet person) who said I was vicious.

      I asked my husband if he thought I was vicious and he said, “Yes.”

      I asked him for an example, because I know of none, in my entire life. He said I yelled at a blonde girl at the pool, for talking to him.

      It’s true, I did that. I was 17 years old, jealous, with flaming pms! I don’t think that’s the same thing. Which is why I posted this. To see how people define the word.

      My husband thinks it is vicious to yell a girl who you think it stealing your boyfriend as a teenager. He’s not exactly wrong, however my pattern over the course of decades is exactly what I wrote above.

      Even back when I was a teen. I thought the gal was on my turf. Once she was no longer on my turf, end of the story. But you can see he has an angle that has some validity.

      I don’t agree with him though. I’m not a vengeful person at all. As soon as I can disentangle myself, you’ll never hear from me or see me again. I don’t care if you kick my teeth down my throat and go on to have a wonderful life. In fact, that would be my preference. 🙂

      • “Flaming PMS…” I love that! Any woman can get vicious during that time. I have felt like Reagan from the Exorcist when I get that way. The least little thing can set me off. My husband just puts all females in a box and claims we all hate each other over some reason or another. I don’t think that I hate other women and I try to be nice, but someone pisses me off first and yes, my temper can make me vicious. I try to scurry away in private and rant until I am exhausted and ALP. [Avoid like plague] until it has passed. But there have been times that I could not run away and oh boy the screaming matches commenced and I am really scared that if someone ever hit me, I would probably kill them. I think about these thoughts and it worries me.

      • In my experience, a Scorpio Moon man never forgets his spouse’s greatest moments of weakness. Occasionally they’ll dredge up those things in their spiteful way, in an argument (or asked directly!) But the true reason why they subconsciously imprint these weaknesses into memory is that they want to protect their most precious wifey. 🙂

        Doesn’t mean you have to put up with negative and largely untrue conceptions! I bet that’s why that person called you that – to shed light on the idea in your relationship.

        • Oh! And his recalling my 17 year old fit, was a joke. I also tried to kill him with a motorcycle helmet once, another jealous rage. These are our funny stories…at least they’re funny to us and people laugh their asses of when we tell them at parties. 🙂

      • If there is a disorder such that “They cannot help themselves” it seems unfair to call them vicious. And I don’t think cheating, lying, stealing or manipulative are, in themselves, necessarily vicious unless those things are done in a malicious manner. Some people steal because they are hungry for food, drugs, money, etc. then lie so not to get caught. Not good but not vicious either. And Elsa, when you yelled at the other teenager at the pool, even though presumably she deserved it, you were being as vicious as you knew how. That does not make you a vicious person. You have a varied set of traits and just because you are capable of acting viciously does not mean you’re a vicious person by nature. Nor does it mean that your husband gets to rub your nose in it 20 years later (seems malicious to me). His take that all women are vicious indicates a misogynistic attitude on his part.

  11. Actually, I thought the 8th house was “sex, death, and other people’s money,” not “evil?”
    I have Virgo Moon in the 8th, have not attracted evil that I know of, only a little sex, too much death, and not nearly enough other people’s money!
    Lots of vicious women on TV soap operas. Thankfully, I haven’t met many in real life.

  12. I think of vicious personality women or men as being malicious based on their distorted beliefs, being vicious by gossip or destructive to someone’s character in some way, whether openly or secretively and/or even doing it out of habit, which probably has an astrological base to it, usually because they have a low opinion of themselves in some way and have to satisfy it by bringing someone else down. Lots of people like that around, the attraction is they think you are better than them for whatever reason and they have to attack, disassociating is the best bet. But male or female predators who can physically stalk, attack or vandalize a person or property for whatever reason are considered criminal, this includes sexual predators. More than the Moon is involved with these behaviors.

  13. My Mother is vicious (but that’s because she’s insane). She, verbally, actively, seeks to destroy others. That’s her term. She knows this and she does this. What I learned from her is that it is impossible to destroy another person. I learned to create a space within that no one can reach. (She is sun/venus aries with venus squ pluto. Pluto in the 7th. I have moon conjunct mars squ pluto.)

    I CAN be vicious. savage. But it is rare and only as a mother hen/last resort. (moon/mars trine saturn). I am on a sloooow burn. I’m the person who remembers the “slight” on the way home. Channelled anger.

    The irony? The more vicious I am, the more powerless I feel. When you go to extremes, there is nowhere left to go. You’ve launched your arsenal, no more weapons. Even if you’ve temporarily won, you’ve already lost. Because you’ve allowed another person to take you to hell.

    • Thanks for writing that. My Aries mother has Sun, Mercury and Venus square Pluto and she can be quite vicious, rebellious, and gossipy, too. I’ve had this gut feeling that she has tried to destroy me or at least gain the upper hand since I’ve had to live with her and my stepfather over these last 4 years. She is controlling over my stepfather, too, but he refuses to argue with her, which I should know by now is futile. Also, my Aquarius SIL has Moon opposition Pluto and Pluto conjunct Uranus and she can be vicious, too so yes, it’s challenging walking on eggshells. I’m a Libra Sun with Pluto square Mars, so you can blast against me all you want (because I’m dumb enough to think you’re smarter than to want to fight), but it won’t put me in submission for long. Actually, the only way to “subdue” me is to reason with me in a calm and sensible way, but it seems they lack that forethought. Actually, I’ve given up trying to have a mutual relationship with either one of them becoz it’s too complicated and anything nice they do I count it as a bonus as they as very selfish/me-oriented women and it drains too much of my time & energy and I have to let it go (or go down the drain with them).

  14. Watch the comedy film “Monster-in-Law”. Pay attention to how Jane Fonda’s character operates. THAT, to my mind, is a vicious woman.

    Vindictive, gaslighting, deceitful bitch with nothing to do all day but twist people around her little finger. Mean as HELL.

  15. As far as thr person who called you vicious– takes one to know one. Projection much? I dont personally know anyone truely vicious. Not that I can recall. If I met someone like this, I’d disassociate myself quickly.

  16. Semantics, eh? Appearing vicious, particularly in an isolated instance hardly indicates a fundamental flaw; mean, unthinking, cruel, excessive perhaps? Vicious comes with intention. That pit bull down the street might be vicious or maybe just a baby and kitten loving goof-head. We all misuse language regularly. Doctors wince at casual misuse of references like “excruciating” “depressed” or any description of pain that isn’t accurate. We have so many more words in English than most other languages but we Americans seem to pick ones that come with a bit more punch to them. When I think of vicious, it conjures a feeling of unmitigated horror. brrrrrrr

  17. I have a Scorpio Moon. My boss can be vicious, and she chose to hire me, so that probably means that I attract the vicious type. Most of the time I have stayed out of her way. I usually don’t have anything that vicious people want, so they move on to someone else.

  18. Sometimes I consult with vicious women. They’re very open about it. Matter of fact, they want to up their game.

    I just talk to them. I do my job. I answer their questions, truthfully. They are not paying me to be their moral judge.

    I have had a few over the years who openly aspire to hone their skills – become as deadly as possible. I do mention there will likely be repercussions. But they either don’t care or don’t believe it to be true and that’s that.

    I wonder sometimes what happened to a person to make them want to destroy others. Because all kinds of things happened to me – horrible. And I don’t feel that way at all.

    • This is so foreign to me. I don’t doubt these women exist. It’s just that I’ve never come across women like this (that I know of). I can be a bit naive at times though. And I am extremely selective with who I hang out with, maybe another reason I don’t come across these types of women. I have a Scorpio moon and do not consider myself vicious. That seems like it would take more energy then I care to spare to engage in the world that way. Interesting post.

  19. Dunno. Maybe a vicious woman and a vicious man are not too different, continually acting out and hurting people. I was listening to a Joe rogan interview and he said Carlos mencia is a ‘villain’… Someone who hurts comics in a careful and continued way, but also just as much a ‘victim.’ I experienced a woman who was trying to show me up at every turn

  20. I don’t think in those terms so much I guess, I do often wonder at men who use street harassment to victimize and overpower women or don’t stop doing threatening things even when you show them you are not for it. Men who gawk and smile and threaten when you show in no uncertain terms its uninvited. I am more likely to wonder at jackal behavior in men, which seems to come from the thought that women are lesser than and theirs for the taking. In Oaxaca or Egypt I’d be pretty screwed. Also, I tend to be threatened by and avoid groups of women, groups of men, and only recently became friends with very pretty women. One on one I had to find their vulnerability and then we could be friends. From this point, partly because I don’t have a ‘group of friends’ or have a dwindling supply, almost none, I’d say that I don’t want to know about vicious women. But seem to be fixated on and thus find plenty of doggish behavior in men. In a couple I’d probably ask the guy if saw him looking ‘what, you want her? Go get her, there’s the door.’ Defensively. Which doesn’t win me many ‘smart woman’ points.

  21. Who even says that to someone, anyway? Though I know you attract all kinds of weird comments.

    I think there’s a certain allure in being vicious. Lust for power. But it just seems like an empty form of power. I actually admit that I have a bit of a lust for power on several different levels, but seeking to destroy others seems like a form of weakness. If you were really that powerful you wouldn’t have to hunt someone down because you wouldn’t see them as a threat. And I guess people who go around being vicious don’t realize that.

    • People say all kinds of crap when they get defensive/their emotions in a twist. How many times on the internet do people compare people to hitler? Think of the nasty stuff moms say about the women who snub their sons, I bet that’s the most vile stuff because it hits so close to home. I still think of the verdict one Pisces mom gave me

  22. ‘Toilet paper your house’, ha! ha! Now that’s creative vicious. Nah, I can’t say I’ve dealt with anyone closely who fits the above description, especially of the female gender. But it’s true what someone else said, there is a sliding scale of vicious. Hell, I can be vicious if someone tries to trash my property or stalk me or harass me, then I take extreme measures to protect myself and my loved ones. But I operate with Macchiavellian efficiency and effectiveness in such cases; ‘vicious’ may not be the appropriate description.
    Protecting your boundaries is one thing;
    wanting to harm people, hunt them, destroy them or indulge evil impulses as a kind of blood sport is another thing altogether; and is not my gig, and never has been. I have known people who do, of both sexes, but at arm’s length. They’ll hang on to a grudge for years and years. I have trouble remembering what even happened years ago.
    I have moon-Uranus, with Uranus trine Jupiter.
    What a fascinating topic!

  23. Hm. I’m not vicious but I’m formidable (Scorpio Moon) and if you betray or cross me I won’t forget and I will also call you on it. This comes as an enormous shock to people because I’m a Leo with Leo rising – sunny, sunny, sunny right until that line is crossed then hello Scorpio!!

    I play by a rule book that’s based on a moral center and I think most people do. Whether it’s nature or nurture, the church or upbringing – most people know what it means to play fair. Vicious women do not have this rule book, don’t give a hoot about boundaries and take advantage of the fact that others do. That’s not me and, honestly, you can’t spend years reading someone’s blog and not get a sense of their character – I really don’t think it’s you either!

  24. The only time I encountered women who were vicious was during a period when I was temping and Pluto was transiting my Moon (conjunct) and squaring my Mercury. There were two women — one was another temp and the other one was a part-timer — and we all did the same work. They both tried to get me fired, which didn’t work. The temp was asked to leave and I was asked to stay on. The part-timer was a known nut-job — a very disturbed personality — so I stayed as long as I could tolerate her. After a year-and-a-half of temping, I got a full-time job and I was able to leave. But that Pluto-Moon transit was a killer. This was 20 years ago and I still remember it like it was yesterday.

  25. Wow, I find this very fascinating. I have a Virgo Moon. I had a Taurus friend who said once, “It’s just too much energy to be angry at people all the time.” I had a Boss, several actually who “Cruel Intentions” other people and yet I didn’t ever find them “vicious’. I felt that I recognized their motivations and through that more understanding of them. People are flawed and they can be unkind.I do have my Moon trine Neptune (Jupiter in the 7th) though so sometimes I can be REALLY blind in how mean some people can be, but I rarely see it as ‘vicious’ cowardly and petty perhaps. I’m not blind when it happens to other people. My definition of vicious is actually similar to Elsa’s. I feel like there a ‘danger’ element to my definition, either emotional, mental, verbal, physical component.

  26. I think of a vicious woman as being able to verbally attack someone and attack very deeply at the person’s core. A vicious woman will attack and dismember the other person’s ego or emotional state so deeply that they will feel tremendous pain and agony as a result, I’d add here, that the vicious woman usually has a hearty insight on a person’s truth and weaknesses and will use their vulnerability to create the pain and thus injury. Yes I know many woman who will do this; my sisters, my mother and sadly my brothers too. Plus; the verbal skills and communication skills, the timing skills of the vicious woman are second to none. They will wait and wait and wait until the time is ripe, and go in for the “kill”, so to speak.

  27. I also read this first as “vivacious”, and I think I read it that way because “vicious” is not a word I would associate with you, even though a) I do not know you personally, only from the forum and b) vivacious is a word I could easily see ascribed to you because of your out-goingness and c) … (PREPARE FOR RANT) WHY THE FUCK are women who have balls (which I believe you have) called “vicious”? Why the fuck is being someone who can stand in her shoes and tell her truth equated with “vicious”? To ME, vicious is when you know someone’s secrets and use them to your advantage. Vicious is when you deliberately set out to hurt someone; vicious is a horrible state of mind engendered by the deeply insecure who feel they have no personal power, so they seek others to disempower, so they have the illusion of power, which is all they know they will ever have, deep down in their core. It’s the epitome of the school yard bully who never grew up and now their defense system has taken over, and it’s no-holds-barred, hostage-taking-time.
    *Lots* of women are SCARY. Because they will stand in their shoes and speak their truth. They are not much liked by those who need ass-kissers around. But to equate “scary” with “vicious” is, in my opinion, speaking more to the need to paint with a very broad brush, simply because of the fear that the “scary” woman will turn “vicious”, even in the absence of any proof of it ever happening. And it’s a pity. Because plenty of those “scary” women are afraid to own their truth, for the fear of being labelled “vicious” by people who are important to them. It’s a fear of being called a “bitch”, just for saying “uhhhhhh, NO”. It’s a really great way to keep strong women oppressed.

  28. To me, vicious is someone who is more offensive than defensive. I’d say yang energy in astrology is more vicious (and Scorpio when they want you dead, LOL). I’d say Yin signs, like me, are more likely to run away from trouble, and I can see why some would see that as being viewed as uncaring and cold. Perhaps that’s why some see it as vicious and mean, when it’s just self-protective.

  29. I think of vicious as really extreme. Like someone going behind your back to completely fuck you over, to make you lose so they can win.

    On the level of cruel, I would say. As such no I’ve never known anyone that bad.

  30. My experience is that one who claims another to be vicious is most likely projecting (or spewing) their own viciousness. Ring ring “hello kettle its the pot calling to tell you that you are black” In my own life I have too frequently been the object of such spewing it took maturity for me to recognize that it was the green eyed monster jealousy rearing it’s ugly head and to not take it personally or feed the negativity. It is remarkable to me how ugly one woman can speak of another because the one being ugly does not like how she measures up to the other based on her own mean judgement of herself. Heavy eye roll get some therapy or better yet love yourself enough not to have to come up short in your own comparison of yourself to someone else. Like when people assume an attractive woman used her looks to gain her success because that can’t handle that she might just be pretty AND smart. Just like Elsa, pretty, smart yes, viscious no way.

    • @ajm1008 Yep…. “Like when people assume an attractive woman used her looks to gain her success because that can’t handle that she might just be pretty AND smart. Just like Elsa, pretty, smart yes, viscious no way”.
      Envy,jealousy,insecurity – are the fuels of viciousness and then what to do with this – putting others down…

  31. With reference to the moon both my sister and sister-in-law have tendancies towards vicisious attack both will at time exploit a soft spot to cause pressure or pain in an attempt to get their way. Both are Taurus moon. Where I think the negative aspect of the Taurus moon shows itself in these two is selfishness and need to make sure they get theirs if they perseve that there is a limited quanity of whatever is desired they will be damned if they are the one to do without. Unfortunately they both put material value on things like love and compassion and both treat people like possessions. Its interesting to look at the moon aspect. I am a Virgo moon very dedicated to service to show love maybe even mardyrdom to refuse to engage in toe to toe vicision attack knowing I could just as easily shred with my razor sharp critical tougue but refusing to engage that way

  32. There is something i have learned – there are human distortions in all of us. I will call them by name – jealousy, envy, competition,judgement, domination, entitlement, anger, rage, resentment…
    They are alive in all of us. Some of us are aware of this distortions and work consciously to transform them in to – Beauty, Grace,Kindness, Elegance, Senior,Reverence, Serenity,Integrity, Dignity, Respect, Humility, Truth, Harmony, Peaceful, Happy…
    Viciousness – is when you are embracing distortions. I have seen many “distorted” selfish people considering themselves very “nice”.
    There are many people which do consider me “vicious” because i have not fell in to their “nicety” and had kind but powerful responses to their behavior. And , of course, they are “nice” and i am vicious, for one reason only,- they can not handle themselves properly. They can not accept powerful people which are also kind and truthful. They see kindness like something cheesy, goofy, alwaaaaaaays friendly and smiley, always in service to them….And if you represent powerful truthful response to them full of integrity- they put their tale between their legs, run away and bark at you in your back or just call you ‘vicious’.
    We all have flaws and defaults in us,- i personally have chosen to not throw around with my “vicious” energy and do not allow others to do that to me…I do not have vicious people in my life any more.I prefer to not talk to them. And somehow they are not approaching me.
    You are not vicious, Elsa- 100% not. I know it is not of my business. May i make a suggestion? That person, which said it to you – is a vicious person him/herself. Somewhere in you is an opening for people like them – people which are throwing with energy. You also said, you had consulted some vicious woman. May be, better to make some boundaries energetically, so that they out of your life for good?

  33. When I’ve seen people behave in vicious ways it’s usually been when they’ve refused to embrace or “lean in” to the reality of their lives at that moment and projected and lashed out to someone else they target as responsible. A vicious person, as I see them, would take that further and prefer plotting vengeance to self- reflection and self- awareness.

  34. I can be vengeful, but I can’t imagine spreading false rumors to try to destroy someone, after not speaking to them for 5 years.

    I do however let people know who I’m dealing with if it comes up.

  35. I wonder if you could identify transits that pull in viciousness . I had a vicious woman verbally attack me in public when Mars was transiting my 7th house. I’m a Jupiter girl and try to dodge and duck when the flame throwers start spewing their fire . I would think Pluto opposing planets would bring in opposition.
    Also because women aren’t supposed to be aggressive, I think their anger and rage can come out sideways. I’ve listened to my daughter share her high school stories and these girls are vicious! Sneaky , sideways mean! I spoke with an Irish woman who said growing up that it was culturally acceptable for girls to fight and their was minimal sneaky meanness. I do think of vicious as Scorpio mean. Like planning, conniving. Evil undermining viciousness.
    But my point is this behavior is all pretty acceptable for men . I mean countries were built on vicious men, let’s face it.

    • “I wonder if you could identify transits that pull in viciousness . I had a vicious woman verbally attack me in public when Mars was transiting my 7th house.”
      7th house = open enemies
      Tr planet = comes from outside/public is outside
      Attack = mars

  36. I’ve only met one truly vicious woman in my life and she is evil. God will handle her so I forget her. I give her a wide berth and live my life. If she darkened my door I would call the police immediately. However, I know plenty of mean and/or jealous women who skirt the boundaries of being vicious. I think they suffer from low self esteem and have bestowed upon themselves an entitlement of some sort. They don’t play by the same rules as everyone else.

    I have a Scorpio moon but I couldn’t be bothered to waste my energy on coming up with revenge ideas or anything like that. Must be Taurus rising on the opposition winning that debate.

  37. I have sometimes been vicious (lots of 8th house activity), but you do not seem vicious. I think 8th house stuff means you are capable of viciousness, given other factors. I also think that people who don’t have so much 8th house stuff *think* that 8th house shadow people are vicious, but it might also just be that they talk straight. You don’t seem vicious to me.

    • Thanks. Within 30 minutes of getting this mail, I had a gal who’s sister in law is dying, call me and ask me to take over her job, overseeing the kids for All Saints and All Souls at church. They are dressing up as their Patron Saints…

      So it’s the complete opposite, really. In real life, I am broadly seen as a benevolent, mothering sort of woman. Let’s just say, I bake a lot of bread!

      And how about when my son and his best friend came home and asked me if 60 kids could come to our house *that evening*.

      My answer was yes. 🙂

      This is just not vicious stuff. I am so disinterested in that kind of stuff, I wouldn’t know any other way to say it. I like chatting with people at yard sales and stuff. I think this is real obvious in real life. On the internet, who know. I have Neptune / MC.

  38. As far as I know, any woman can go vicious if her cubs are threatened. It’s the one thing I’ve come to know about moms (and I mean moms who mom). They will kill for their young. So yes, the potential is there. I’ve been hunted. I always feel like I am being mistaken for someone else. Either this life, or past life. I find it puzzling. I have no clue what the hunter thinks they are after. And with men, the same thing. With them, via relationship, it’s like they need to kill my spirit. That’s the challenge. I let it happen once or twice and then was derided for being nothing. Watch the cat toy with the mouse, and then loose interest when it is dead. I don’t know about evil, it just seems blood hungry to me. Could be an evolutionary throw back.

    • I love that I did not know back then what “they” were after. I do now. I had to go through those encounters of the vicious kind to find out what about me threatened them. What they wanted to kill. It helped me to identify the thing I have. They can’t kill it, and they definitely can’t get it from me. They have to find it for themselves.

      I actually do make some progress. 😀

  39. Are you vicious?

    Well if you touch my children you will see the kind of crazy you only read about. Otherwise I coast on my Cancer asc and Taurus moon.

    I am not going to hunt a person. I am not going to waste my time talking about them or spreading rumors to destroy their lives. I am not going to bother anyone for any reason unless they do something horrid to me. Then I will fight back. With my stellium I would fight back. And I wouldn’t stop until they left me be. I never throw the first punch but I will throw the last.

    I need to say this. Who the hell does someone think they are to send that kind of email. It takes a special kind of coward to hide behind a keyboard and write that kind of thing. You have a person giving a whole lot away for no monetary gain. Useful information is given to people who need help…. if you cant handle the truth, then don’t ask for it. If you, (author of the email) sent that same email to me you might think I am vicious.

    Many times when a person is handed straight talk, from the hip advice from folks that have lived through hell and kept on walking… it seems harsh to hear a truth. If you do ‘A’ then ‘B’ is going to follow and you may not like ‘B’ or ‘B’ may cause you to come completely undone. Telling the truth is not vicious. Who wants some sugar coated version of the consequences of bad behavior?

    (from above) * I do think of vicious as Scorpio mean. Like planning, conniving. Evil undermining viciousness! ^^^ and then *** and Scorpio when they want you dead LOL ^^^
    ^^^^ giggles…. yeah, I would love to debate this but if I am completely honest and I try to be honest here… just leave Scorpio alone. Seriously, just leave them alone. Its probably best to leave things with stingers that are hiding under rocks not bothering anyone alone. It’s pretty simple. Why would anyone throw a rock at a packed 8th house, a Scorpio moon, anyone with Mars in Scorpio or a Scorpio sun. Just leave them alone… would ya? But if you ask any one of these people a question, they are probably going to tell it like it is. You wont like that so they will be labeled vicious. SMH…. one further, Mars in Scorpio might also knock you on your ass!

  40. Dear Elsa,
    I really need to share my thought on your principle of ‘once you left my property I won’t hunt you in any matter or way”.
    I vaguely remember we have some astrological similarities, I thought you have Aquarius ASC like I do. Now I know you have Jupiter Moon (I have Jupiter in Pisces and MC, and mars-nept in Sag).
    But I have Taurus Moon… and I do have a hard time letting things and people go (or forgetting harsh words and deeds, athough I am not vindictive myself I think).
    I am pretty convinced that what you are talking about, and which I recognise and completely agree with (once you’re off my property etc…) has to do with the Aquarius ASC. It is a healthy detachment in socializing with all kinds of people. These are healthy boundaries which make socializing in a global way possible without being in ‘war’ all of the time with one or more persons. I am curious if you agree with me 🙂

    Greetings Brex

    • Hi, Brex. I don’t have an Aquarius ascendant. Capricorn. Which is sensitive to rejection! So if you don’t like me, or treat me poorly…I (Jupiter) leave!

      I’m very easy to get rid of…but not on my own blog or in my own house, because I live/work here.

      I grew up in a bar…in that I started tending bar when I was 15. If you harassed me, you got 86’ed. It’s a dispassionate thing. And I was just raised to stay out of other people’s business…which make sense to me, since I have my own business.

      In reality, I like being happy and productive…productivity IS happiness to me, so I am just not into all this other seething stuff because I feel it’s a waste of time.

      But yeah. I have to live on my turf…but I can’t think of a time I ever went to another person’s turf and gave them any kind of trouble. If I’m around it is to help or give you something…maybe ask something of my neighbor, with the total understanding that I will pay or reciprocate in some way.

      I guess I was taught I had a place and to stay in it. I just don’t feel entitled to other people’s time or energy or anything else. So I invite or I am invited, and it I cause a problem for anyone…any indication I have that this has happened, I retreat, immediately.

      Whole lot of Capricorn here, obviously. 🙂

      • Then it’s the lot of Cap that we share 🙂 (my sun, merc, and venus in cappy). But my Asc is clearly Aquarian. I don’t leave easily (taurus moon) but when I do, I never come back… 😉
        Thanks and greets!

      • wow i didnt realize that was a capricorn thing. i am sensitive to rejection as well, and if treated poorly. I think that’s why i love being with my husband (as well as love him) because he treats me like a queen/princess. i dont feel entitled to anything either, but he makes me feel entitled.

  41. i am the SAME way, where i am vicious when i see another woman trying to put digs on my man. (possessive and pissed off) i see red and i’m gonna charge. I dont hesitate at all, and there’s gonna be some viciousness going on. But that stuff with taking revenge and doing bad things to people, is gross. My ex slashed my tires and did some bad stuff because i didnt want to be with him anymore (he was violent and abusive) and it was the only way he could possess me, was through abuse and to be in terror. He was mentally unstable i realize.

    Anyway, vicious women or persons would be more like cruelty where they are going to shit all over your lawn and car and property because they are just deeply jealous and cruel inside and can’t let go. They love to terrorize and the feeling of terrorizing others gives them a temporary thrill. At least that’s what I am guessing. it’s that misery loves company — where they are miserable inside so they might as well make everyone else feel it too!

  42. I’ve met a few vicious women in my life yet not many. I just don’t like to be around them so I avoid them, or keep the exchanges light and short.

    Women experience so much oppression in life already that I really believe in supporting each other. Sisterhood!

    My experience is that women who don’t trust or like women had really horrible experiences growing up with (or around) the women in their lives (or even with men who pitted women against women in their families) and learned maladaptive ways to survive in their early environment which, unfortunately, they still think they have to use in adulthood.

    I’m not a vicious woman (and to sure I just asked my husband too) yet with a busy 8th house I will protect myself and loved ones if provoked. I’ll draw a big line on the floor or the air, or involve someone who can help deal with the problem. In fact this is what I find most effective – to involve someone/have a witness as soon as I see a second red flag around something or someone.

    8th house moon trine pluto, moon square sun and opposite Neptune, moon trine venus.

  43. I can’t read anything vicious about you, my guess men use the word
    Like”a force to be reckoned with”?
    I have one experience.awful, what this woman ( inhuman) said to me, mind you I have actually pulled out of a store parking lot, to avoid her
    And since kept my radar on to detect
    ( I live on tiny island)
    She said a neighbor ‘s dog kept
    Visiting despite how she put poison
    In food for it, makes me shake to repeat ,shocked, wordless I froze hearing, that’s a vicious person.
    You could never qualify for that
    Form of being or mind
    I feel sinful just sharing
    I have found people troubling
    Meddling or mean but for vicious
    An odd breed.

  44. Im not vicious, but I dont put anything past myself.

    To me, a vicious woman is one that goes out of her way to hurt others. Its not about protecting anything. Its an abberation in their feminine soul. Its a sickness really. Because the feminine essence nurtures and protects the creation process, when a certain type of woman seeks to destroy, its a dark dark thing.

    I feel like this is the gal who would seduce and steal your husband, convince him to leave you and the kids and take the money, decimate your family and then drop him the minute there was nothing left to destroy.

    Ive encountered a couple, but not many. Even had a couple come after me. In fact just had one yesterday that tried to destroy something Im trying to build with someone. I knew the minute I saw her that she was sick, so I avoided her. Well she figured out a way to come in the back door. It didnt work.

  45. I work with one, a double Gemini, she can’t help herself. My son’s father left me for another, another Gemini.

    My moon is in Scorpio.

    I’ve learned not to react anymore, just observe and store info, because if you react, that’s how they get their jollies.


    Because karma is a BITCH.

    I used to be vicious in my 20’s if you came after my reputation but it always blew up in the my face and now know at this ripe old age, you realize it all comes full circle.

    And if you’re blessed, karma lets you watch.

  46. Dear Elsa
    The most vicious woman I met is capable of all you wrote before.
    She Has scorpio-saggitarius stellium with one distinct square- Neptune in Sag square venus-mars conjunction in Virgo(heavy drinker). She is so succesful now with recent transit of Jupiter through Scorpio and Sag.Her moon is widely conjunct Uranus and Jupiter natally. With numerous children she is a neglecting parent. She is like Hitler – one square takes it all- and he also had moon-jupiter conjunction in water sign.
    I am so resentful that I only wait when Jupiter will hit her Neptune- mars venus square and she will drink herself to oblivion.
    Personally i have Jupiter moon conjunction in Taurus.

  47. I do not think that I am vicious but, I’ve been told I have a vicious tongue. I think those who provoke me will often get the sharper side of that tongue but, I never “attack” without provocation. I’m thinking that’s just the Mercury-Mars thing, honestly. I define vicious as synonymous with malicious. Someone who still attack w/o valid cause, just for fun, or just to be mean.

  48. I think you’re right about vicious women going beyond defending an out and out attack on possessions, family, reputation, self, etc. Vicious women will plot to decimate a person to a bloody pulp and beyond. It’s a mindset. It’s a way they settle scores, teach that person a lesson, get even.

    It seems exhausting. I have moon conjunct Pluto but my moon trine Jupiter (also trining Pluto exact) is a winner.

  49. Women have been demeaned and projected upon for centuries. We refuse to carry the shadow any longer. And we refuse to be defined by others. Call that being a bitch and we say who cares?

  50. OMG that’s me! I am vicious if I chose to be (I have a lot of sag) but Pluto in 8 h and Pluto, Uranus and Mars in tight conjunction in Virgo (11&12 h). So, I’m super vicious to people who are cruel to me and other people especially bullies or bullying bosses. I will bring you down if you lie, cheat, abuse your power and make my life a misery.
    I had a boss who was a director of a large prestigious organisation. She wasted £ thousands on not following up my projects and threw my strategy I spent months writing in the bin (didn’t read it). She told lies about colleagues and generally evil – she made men cry and fear for their jobs. So I spoke to powers that be after tracking her corruption for 3 years then once they looked deep into the finances she was walked out of the building by security guards! I was so elated. Normally I’m nice but if you go too far… Doom ???

  51. The partners to the Moon and Venus are also their shadows – Saturn and Pluto. When we manifest within ourselves the transformational destruction and death of Pluto without projection – animus diminishes – and something new emerges.

  52. I don’t think i’m vicious, but a lot of times people are amazed at what a pottymouth i am: i curse and i swear (mars-gemini)! I can be mean i guess, but not often though, i try to be as friendly as i possibly can. People usually call me sweet (especially my students), but also tough or too hard on myself, probably due to a lot of Saturnal energy in my chart. With an 8th house Sun i extract some dark shit sometimes, and with a 12th house moon, well, it’s sensitivity to my surroundings all the time.

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