Can You See Suicidal Tendencies In A Natal Chart?

suicideHi, Elsa.

Went through your post about overcoming fear of death. I, somehow, find death an easy alternative of pain that life may have brought. I have been suicidal from ever since I was a teenager. I attempted when I was 14, 17, 24, 27… Of which last three attempts severely affected my body leading to long hospitalization. I survived ’em all miraculously.

Each of the time it felt like a new birth and I decided to not to do it again. But ended up repeating in a new situation that somehow had roots in my childhood. What in astrology can describe suicidal tendencies? A kind of desperation to escape life?

Perennially Suicidal

Dear Perennial,

People commit suicide for a variety reasons. They may be organically, mentally ill. They may be profoundly depressed and despairing or they may be angry or simply impatient with life. They may lack faith or clarity.

They may be led to suicide via some powerful figure (like Jim Jones).

They may commit suicide in response to some specific trauma.

For example, the teenage son of one of our friends brought a gun to his best friend’s house, where he was to spend the night. His friend accidentally shot himself in the face and died. Registering what happened, two hours later, the boy climbed on top a tall structure. He called the police (to tell them where to find his body) and then  jumped to his death. It was three in the morning. Can you imagine the knock on the door of the parent’s house?

Still other people commit suicide because they’re suffering with terminal illness.

Many gay kids kill themselves because coming out to their parents (or whoever) is just too daunting…

I could probably sit and type out fifty more scenarios off the top of my head. Considering the scope here, I don’t think it would be possible to narrow this to one or two aspects.

Further, if I were to list some aspects that seemed to indicate something like this, every mother of every child who had the aspect in their chart would be set to worry.

Any aspect in any chart can be used in a positive way. There are no exceptions here! For example, people who help those who are suicidal have often been suicidal themselves.

I have experience with people like you. This is why I sat on this question for a few days. I was trying to decide if I should say this or not. Say that I know a number of people who made repeated attempts to kill themselves.

Every single one of them was successful, eventually. It becomes an addiction in a way.

It’s like these Hollywood stars or musicians who mix all kinds of drugs. The skirt around the edge of death right up until they don’t.

With five suicide attempts under your belt, you may want to quit bettin’ the farm, okay?  Because your family will suffer.

Good luck.

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Can You See Suicidal Tendencies In A Natal Chart? — 75 Comments

  1. With depression ruling most of my years I have thought about suicide a lot but not to the degree Perennially suffers from. I never attempted it so I really feel for you. What helped me most and kept me back was realizing that our actions affect everyone around us so that suicide would be hurtful to so many others. It would utterly destroy my mother and leave my young son rudderless. I couldn’t do that to someone. Life is pain but it is also a strange gift and what we end up accomplishing with it is the gift we give back. It also helped me to realize that like the trees or blades of grass, we’re all created uniquely different. It makes me think that God is emphasizing that we are one-off, special beings with a specific place in the scheme of things. My wife suffers anxiety (childhood issues) so the doc put her on some medicine that relaxes her a lot. I use a process called EFT, or emotional freedom technique. The thing is, you need some outside help with this and there’s no shame in feeling the way you do. If you haven’t gotten some clinical evaluation already, it might be helpful to see what options are out there. Don’t go it alone.

  2. I think, family, friends, lovers, spouse, kids should not be the walking stick through the bumpy roads of life. There are many who literally have no family or been shunned off, abandoned at an young age. In most of the cases these very people often drive the victim to that helpless path to dead-end, knowingly/unknowingly. At times, people wish if you could just die. I was personally, indirectly requested so as to save the “honour” of someone. I have been told time and again by some family members that it would have easier for ’em to deal with my death than the living unacceptable pain,I am. There are many who always end up with people within and outside family where they are treated you like an appendix, no matter how far they go to secure a walking stick.
    It’s the loneliness, not finding that if at all anyone care if one does or survives.
    Selfish people are many a times bruised ones, because they indulge in self love. May be they are materialistic because non living things don’t hurt. Self love is the key? Is not that Venus? How to work with Venus?

    • No one’s “honour” is worth dying for, worth another person’s life! How dare they!
      Pursue what your Venus loves, whatever that may be, and others who share that interest will enter your life.

  3. Hits too close to home. I like writing though. Yes, attempted two times. First time, I heard my friend’s voice and realized that there were those who cared for me. Second time, just dumb luck, I could have took all the pills, but the doorbell rang and I dropped them. After the second time, that was it, no more attempts. Astrology, Capricorn Moon square Pluto? Plus Pisces Sun. I know it doesn’t apply to all, but probably applies to my life.

    • “Astrology, Capricorn Moon square Pluto? Plus Pisces Sun.”

      Saturn Moon square Pluto and Neptune in combination..
      I have Moon square Pluto and am suicidal since I was a kid, and I read somewhere that is a suicidal aspect.

    • You’ve been such a positive presence on this blog, AH. I think many of us feel like our lives improved because of your presence

  4. For anyone who has attempted suicide, has anyone ever said to you “How do you know being dead is better?” or something similar? Someone said it to me when I expressed suicidal feelings but it has to be said I never actually took the steps to end my life so my experience may not be relevant For those who have, did it make your pain better, worse, unchanged?

    • My husband always says this..it will be much worse, once dead. He really feels people are in for a surprise. His view has definitely made me think about it. I have Neptune in Scorpio and tend to idealize death. I’m careful about this, these days. I realized the bliss (of escape) I imagined was in fact, imagined.

      • Elsa, your husband is very wise. Some believe that if we take our lives we are doomed to repeat them in every way over and over, no escape at all.

      • I feel the same way Elsa. The person who said that to me was my father and it really made me stop and think as well. What it helped me figure out is that when I say “I would rather die younger in my sleep than live to old age still alone without companionship, affection and sex,” I really mean I want to become lose my desire for those things, become indifferent so I can enjoy what I do have. I think my Scorpio moon has a lot o do with that opinion.

        Is a meaningful life possible without romantic love? Most definitely. A happy one? For me, the answer is no. My loneliness in an odd way is probably why I’m not more suicidal, because without love I don’t feel I’m alive in any way that really matters.

        • People think different things at 30 or 40 or 50, they can’t imagine when they’re younger. My husband and both have our best friends, dead young. What we wouldn’t give to be able to have them here now.

          I lost both my closest friends from when I was young, when they we’re in their 20s. One to suicide (her 6th attempt. Called for help but they got there too late). The other was a car accident. So, so young.

    • Agreed. I’ve never seen anyone ever recover from it, and I’ve watched one family for 40 years. They all be haunted to their graves. A mother, sister and brother this is.

      • Even if the suicidal person wants to hurt others, to punish them, get revenge, by dying, THAT is not worth sacrificing all the potential joy and adventure and reward life has to offer. Amputate them, create a new life for yourself and leave the pain behind.

          • It’s also selfish for another to abuse and control a child to the point that he or she feels suicide is the only escape. Some of those parents you see bawling their eyes out over a child’s suicide may be narcissists putting on a grand show for onlookers who actually couldn’t care less their child is dead and are at mos just angry kiddo is no longer around to serve their purposes.

  5. I don’t know how old are you now, but it seems to me that these suicude attempts were made while you were a teen. I remember my adolescency as a dark and gloomy time, so I can see your point. The thing is, I agree, you should consider your family and their feelings, as it would hurt them immensly, but I think that you should consider your feelungs first. I’m pretty sure you do not want to die. You just want this pain to stop. And luckily, death is not the only way, however tempting it may seem. You should go and see a specialist, cause it seems to me that you have an issue with impulsivity and impulse control, so a good therapist could help. I would reconsider the fact that you’ve survived five(!) serious suicide attempts. I don’t think it’s just dumb luck. Something in you wants to live. Do not dismiss that will so easily, since it is a powerful force to reckon with. I really wish you the strenght to work through all the dark things that you’ve mentioned. Keep up the good work!

    • “Something in you wants to live.” And the universe wants you to live. You have a purpose here to fulfill. You can find that purpose, and pursue it, for yourself, and the pain will fade away in time.

  6. Pain doesn’t always fade. You can find joy in many other areas of life during the day and still cry yourself to sleep every night. Tony Robbins says you have to find a mission in life that’s worth more than your pain. I think he’s damn right. But it doesn’t mean what hurts gets better. Fades a bit maybe.

    • Tony Robbins is right. Pain may not disappear altogether, but it does fade. New ups and downs come along and push it into the background. Everyone lives with some pain — loss, grief, abuse, regret, guilt, betrayal. Everyone is “walking wounded,” some just hide it and overcome it well by filling the void with rewarding pursuits they might never have discovered otherwise.

      “Living well is the best revenge.”

      • Pain is the part of this world, and of life. So is the joy. There will never be one without the other.
        This is Scorpionic theme. As is the suicide. I’m reminscing about the book “The Stranger”, A. Camus. The thing is to choose whether to live or not. Immense pain can darken our perspective, and force us NOT to choose, but to follow the impulse to perish. And it might not be our ultimate and free-willed choice.

      • We learn to live with it over time. Whether it fades or not. Resisting the pain makes it even more powerful. Let it come. Let it devour you, surrender to it. It’s not that bad. It’s okay to be in pain. It’s okay to see life panning out exactly opposite the way you planned. It’s okay to live with a broken heart or to be emotionally handicapped. All worst kind of things in life are Okay so long as changing things are beyond your control. Persist.
        That’s what I tell myself now a days.

  7. Not everyone can live well when they are in soul-destroying prolonged romantic loneliness and general soul agony. A meaningful life does not always equal a happy life and not every emotionally hungry person has the fortitude to convincingly put on a show of being happy to starve.

    Gloria Steinem wrote a recent article where several post-menopausal women said losing their libido was the best thing that ever happened to them because it was the only thing that eased the loneliness. Mother Nature has it right. No customers shut down the business.

    • Who says it’s romantic?! Loneliness is devastating. I had the experience of transiting Pluto conjuncting Venus. It was soul-crushing! It was a looong period of loneliness, so it had time to transform into solitude. To be fair, I still don’t like being alone, and feeling lonely. But it can be the time of great thinking and great insights, also.

    • Exactly! both things are different. Meaningful life is not necessarily a bed of roses with your sweetheart.
      Loneliness is sometimes a Fact. So be it. Grit your teeth and walk through it. Screw hope that things may change. Why Care if it does or does not. Being happy is not a compulsion. It’s a mere wish.

  8. Danka, you’re right, it doesn’t have to be romantic, I was referring to myself only. There are all kinds of loneliness. I actually like spending a lot of time alone but truly hate not having a partner. Great thinking and great insights can come from long periods of time alone, but I’ve had enough of epiphanies and would frankly trade them all for some male companionship.

    • I know what you mean. I have struggled with horrific loneliness of the romantic variety to the point where it’s very difficult to enjoy life, and I expect much more to come. But I don’t know what could happen in ten years, I don’t even know what could happen in one year. I could get lucky, and I try to live the best I can for myself in the meantime. I can’t promise myself happiness that way, but sometimes my efforts pay off in other ways.

      So yeah, it ain’t exactly a blast, but you’re not alone in feeling like that. <3

  9. Permanent solution to a temporary problem. Why go early when you have more chances to right what may be wrong. Even when everything feels impossible there’s always that slight chance…”what if” things get better. Man, you gotta hold onto that “what if.” How many success stories start out with epic failures, ya know? 🙂 What is life if not an opportunity to learn from our mistakes (no matter how big, shameful, and embarrassing they may have been). Gotta push through that feeling…give it space to grow instead of snuffing it out.

    • I beg to differ. Not that I’m against hope but That’s like fooling yourself with those “what ifs”. Why one should look for what ifs? Why should not one look for “So what?”

        • “So what” helps actually in the long run. Caring a damn about whatever went wrong and carrying on as compared to going by what ifs with false hopes.
          But I get your point. An emotionally vulnerable someone would accept hope more readily. But for how long that ll keep him off the next attempt? Provided things never changed?

  10. I read this and thought you can’t really see this in a natal chart because suicide is very much something an individual decides to do.

    I have never attempted suicide, but I had considered it many, many times. I would be one of those people who jumps infront of a train or something.

    My SO has attempted suicide before, and he did so because he felt trapped.

    I considered suicide because I was absolutely miserable/depressed, and I didn’t think I could ever be happy. There were 2-3 times *per year* that I was able to feel happy, for nearly two decades, so feeling happy was very fleeting/infrequent. The rest of the year, I felt miserable and that there was no point in living. Whenever I felt happy, it would go away as fast as it came. I would never have imagined that I would be able to feel happy on a near daily basis.

  11. A friend who had a near death experience & was touch & go with horrendous injuries (set to be life changing), said that at some point (when initially in hospital), she was given a choice. She could leave, but she’d have to come back again & “redo” her story, to learn her lessons. Or, she could stay & keep moving through them all- clear them.

    If that were me, I wouldn’t want to come back & start again from square one. Once is enough, thanks! May as well get through it now & realise that we never know the end of the story, til we’re there. Who’s to say they won’t improve?? To do this, you have to believe that you have the opportunity & the freedom to improve things for yourself, day by day. I reckon staying is the better bet in the gamble, even if it’s excruciating, at times.

    The ultimate irony would be to take your life, just before things were due to improve!! Ya just never know. Push the energy the other way… refuse to let it beat you, no matter *how* much it all hurts. Look UP, not DOWN.

  12. Not really something I would ever do. And especially now with my son, I would never ever consider it.

    But I have thought sometimes at a few low moments, I can’t see where life can truly be that much better- not enough for suicide, but enough to Google those feelings and being led to suicide stories. And here’s just practical, hard information in case anyone is considering suicide- IT DOES NOT ALWAYS WORK.

    There are people who for whatever reason botched their suicide and wound up crippled, brain dead, physically destroyed in every way but ALIVE and AWARE.

    It sounds absolutely horrific. I hope even in a depressed fog that anyone considering suicide would turn away from that.

    It must be awful, really.

        • Yes, particularly when you did it to yourself.
          My husband knows someone like this. He meant to blow his head off, he wound up losing half his face and lives this way today.

          You gotta ask yourself, what he might have learned.
          Life with whole face – not worth living.
          Life with half your face – worth living.

          • Yeah so one needs to make sure. Lol when I attempted I took sleeping pills, plenty of them, about 80 with more 10 mg each. ground & mixed with rum. Did cut my wrist too, pretty deep then tried going to the roof to jump (I live in a 3 storey building so, I had to do other things) but could not make it and I was partially paralysed for a few months. Worse is under whatever anti depressants medication I was, I had no sense of feelings towards anything! Like a dead man. Scold me, beat me up, cry in front of me, insult me….I had no reaction to anything, I was staring blank at everything. No fear either! Completely unaware of anything not even my pain which drove me to do it! It’s something we call loosing ones mind, may be in a literal sense. I’m glad I can smell the betrayal again n mourn, if nothing else.

              • Thank heaven you recovered! This song by Donald Fagan, “I’m Not the Same Without You,” might cheer you up a bit.

            • What horrified me about the notion of suicide (in my darkest hours) was the notion that I would have to relive that karma all over again. Like suicide was a pussies way out. Like you couldn’t hack it so you opted out, ya know? I was fully aware of the fact it was a spineless move but still didn’t care. BUT the notion of living the whole shit all over again absolutely horrified me so I made myself push through it. These are feelings, my friends. They are feelings you’re meant to work through and accept. There’s nothing wrong with being someone who loses all the time 🙂 lol I’ve mastered the art of failure. It takes time to accept the fact that it’s okay and “oh well” life doesn’t always work out the way we want it to. That’s when I found peace. NOTHING is that serious. There is humor to be found even in the darkest places. I remember telling a friend of mine, who shared a story about one of their friends jumping out a window, “what if right after they jumped and hit the ground they thought to themselves…oh shit, maybe this wasn’t a good idea?” lol Getting smacked into reality like that has a way of jolting us back into reality, ya know? Suddenly we’re not all caught up in our emotions. THAT is the point of suicidal feelings. BAM! Get out of your head, man. You have give it space to process instead of acting on it in an impulsive manner.

  13. Edit:

    “If that were me, I wouldn’t want to come back & start again from square one. Once is enough, thanks! May as well get through it now & realise that we never know the end of the story, til we’re there. Who’s to say they (THINGS!) won’t improve??”

    Man! =D

  14. Wow. I’m so touched right now after reading this. I’m so sad for this person and I’m so grateful that you addressed them elsa.

    I’ve attemped suicide once. It was a reaction to an antidepressant that had been taking for a week when I was seventeen. It was one of those “may cause suicidal tendencies in teens and young adults” side effects. But this was a time when that wasn’t really known about. I had never been suicidal before or since. I guess I just never saw it as a way out. I found other ways out. Music. Books. Prayer. There’s are so many levels of life to explore. So many perspectives. Id urge this person to find one that feels good.

  15. It’s not our life to take, really. Time to read up on the Final Judgement. Suicide can seem like an escape but Our Maker didn’t give us life to take it away ourselves, He decides when we have suffered enough. People don’t get it that we are not here to stay, we have to do our mission in life as much as it hurts (and it will)and wait for our natural death. I take religion and a prayer life seriously to get me through the tough times. I’m not undermining people’s suffering, I’ve come close to suicide myself and not once, but I believe in an eternal life after our life and I’m seriously scared that suicide will mess that up.

  16. I’m just floored by all the responses. I’m sorry that suicide resonates with so many people. It certainly resonates with me. I saw my first psychologist when I was eight or nine years old. I’ve lived on four different psych wards and have been on everything from Prozac to Lithium (the most consistent diagnosis I’ve received is “major depression” although a psychiatrist diagnosed me as bipolar II in 2010…I disagree with that diagnosis and haven’t been on meds since 2011…for me the sides aren’t worth it…but I’ve survived on disability for depression and anxiety since 2011…hope to get off disability after I finally graduate from college this spring and get a job I can hold down). One of the lowest points of my life (there have been many low points)was when I had a horrible job interview in an upscale women’s boutique on Union Street in San Francisco. The manager talked down to me. At one point she actually said,”Looking at your resume I see that you’ve moved around a lot and changed jobs quite a bit. What exactly do you want to do, Misti?” It was horrible. I sat on a bench watching a guy mow a soccer field. I thought of all the jobs I’d been fired from, all the friends and lovers I’d lost, how my own mother and sister wished death on me, how I’d failed as my son’s mother and had no idea when and if I would ever see him again. I rode a bus to the Golden Gate Bridge, thought long and hard about jumping off the bridge. I don’t know why I didn’t. Cowardice, I guess. I look at my grand mutable cross…Mercury squaring Saturn tight. I look at my childhood (I’m so tired of looking backward). My parents failed me but this is common. My father abused me then abandoned me. Again, common. I do NOT want to identify as a victim! I want to identify as an ass kicker. Not to pat myself on my own back but just to illustrate how deeply I love my son: I am committed to staying alive, getting off disability and finding a job in a city I both love and hate. I cannot express in words how much I hate driving (unless I’m on a road trip and money isn’t an issue, which is pretty fucking rare). I live in a car city. The traffic is crazy making. The other night I made myself drive thirty miles to a destination I found via Google (I’m horrible with directions)because I wanted to have a good experience with my son. I got lost in the dark several times, had to go outside my comfort zone and ask strangers for help. I was damn determined to find the place (Donkey Lady Bridge…based on an urban legend). I finally did. My son is a double Scorpio. If I killed myself he would not recover. And if I don’t make a better life for myself, a life worth living, I will feel like dying every fucking day. I don’t want to even FEEL like dying is better than living. Damn it. It’s hard. Most days I feel invisible. My phone doesn’t ring. I think of all the stuff I’ve put out out there and wonder why there is no return. For whatever reason I am supposed to overcome various obstacles. I feel my life has been hard for a reason. I’ll die someday having no idea what that reason was.

    • Wow…San Francisco…one of the best places on earth *sigh* Everybody wants to live there so there’s not enough room!! lol OMG I was fired from a job before the shift even ended when i was in San Francisco. They couldn’t even tell me I was fired to my face. They called the temp agency i was working for who discreetly called me on the phone and told me to pack up my shit because it was over. I was totally humiliated. She actually said to me that I would get a little extra money if I “left without making a scene.” As if I was going to pull a machine gun outta my bag or something? lol Like they have this whole firing thing down to a science and surgically remove you like an offensive mole. I cried like a baby on the way home. Sadass mess even I don’t like to admit to other people (but, hey, none of you know me personally so there it is. lol) A beautiful soul came to sit next to me on the bus trying to console me. Point being that not all people are shit. I guess we learn to gravitate towards the right people instead of assuming the whole human race is crap and we shouldn’t be alive because we came across one of the meaner versions of our species. Like Leonard Cohen had said in his song “There is a crack in everything…that’s how the light gets in.”

  17. I have never felt suicidal so I can’t put myself in anyone’s shoes but it sounds horrible. Whenever I hear of suicide I think of the family they leave behind who will never recover. 🙁

  18. I have been steeped in shit most of my life. Some because of the family I was born into, some I caused myself but didn’t realize it at the time.

    Every time it got deep and I thought about an exit for a moment I got strong and thought, F that person (the person that caused the pain) and decided …. I’ll show you! I have no idea what part of my birth chart causes the strong will to prove to an asshole they are wrong about me when they try to either put me in my place or break off a big piece of my heart.

    After the physical pain I have been through over the last 2 years and mostly over the last 2-3 months I can say with a clear head, there is NO way I have what it takes to suffer through anything worse than what I have just been through. I wouldn’t allow my pet to suffer needlessly. Why do I have to? I would NOT, knowing that there is no way to heal ever consider wasting away to 60 lbs in the most hideous pain a person could live through. I would end it even if I thought I would have to come back and repeat it again.

    I don’t think anyone should have to live through the kind of physical pain I have watched people live through when I worked in the hospital or hospice. I have had a small taste of what’s to come these last few months.

    I have been through enough bullshit in my life. The thing that takes me needs to be swift, get it over fast, because I know with great certainty today that I will not be allow myself to linger on in that kind of circumstance. Ever. As far back as forever we put animals down but people are made to live in wretched pain until they can barely take a breath. I think its ridiculous.

    I do believe in God. I also believe in Jesus and would hate to let either down, but I DO NOT have what it takes to suffer for months trying to heal from something its impossible to heal from. Waiting months on end in agonizing pain. I have hope. But I also know hopes limits. I will always shoot for the best, pray, and try. But when I get to the place where I know there is no way to fix a health crisis and I could never heal from a grim diagnosis….I am Out.

    • This is my life. I decide. Selfish? I don’t know. What I do know is lingering physical pain with no quality of life is not for me.

      • Soup, big hug. I don’t find your viewpoint selfish. I think it’s selfish for say a healthy person to expect a person in unimaginable pain and distress to hang on longer than he/she wants to. Quality of life can only be determined by the individual in my view and no one has a right to impose what THEY think is right on someone else.

        What you wrote about seeing prolonged suffering in a hospice setting made me wonder if you read about the palliative care nurse from England in her 70s who died at a Swiss euthanasia clinic because she had did not want to risk becoming ill/incapacitated with age. She’d simply seen too many patients dying prolonged awful deaths.

        She was still in okay health but was beginning to develop some problems. She was married with children. Her family objected, promised to care for her if she became ill and she still chose to end her life.

  19. I’m characteristically a depressive type and I’ll give credit to my Cancer,Jupiter,Uranus moon for it. Honestly ending it all has crossed my mind, but then I surrender to thoughts of what life for my family would be like without me.

    Mental illness scares me like nothing else I’ve ever encountered in life. Not to say that I’m scared as in running away or not wanting to help someone who is having a breakdown, but the mind is so volatile that in my desire to help I could say something to make it worse for someone.

    My daughter attempted to kill herself just over a year ago, in a most grotesque manner. She tried to slash her neck, when her brother confronted her about drinking and entertaining a older guyfriend she met at work. We never met this fella to this day, and she had invited him over without telling anyone. Thank God her brother was able to wrestle the kitchen knife away before she killed herself in that instant. I’m sure the alcohol fueled this horrible event, but her pain had to escalate to this before we as a family recognized she had a very big problem.

    Emotionally she’s getting better and stronger, and continues to see a psychotherapist at college. Thank God for trained professionals to help her and others who suffer with severe depression and general anxiety disorder and other mental illnesses.

    Historically I believe mental illness has caused more death and destruction of lives and families than any physical infirmity ever did. It’s just people don’t like to talk about it, and it’s swept under the rug. It’s also a travesty our healthcare system doesn’t do more to help.

  20. I’ve tried twice, 14 and 25. I have pisces sun conjunct IC which is at the midpoint of neptune and chiron which is quintile both. From the time I was little I always felt love and angels and knew there was so much more going on than what we see. I feel it. I long to return home(cancer north node 8th house) where we are all a family and just love eachother. We are all connected. I have a hard time Here. Astrology became a part of my life the last 9 years and it has helped me change my life.

  21. it definitely is about the individual and not the aspect. for example, sylvia plath and i share the sun in the eighth house and her poem “lady lazarus” resonates with this placement (“dying is an art and i do it extraordinarily well. i do it so it feels real. i do it so it feels like hell.”)

    but sylvia plath died by suicide and i have not because i prefer to “die before you die so you don’t die when you die”

    there are other ways to die and be reborn that don’t require suicide attempts. try it.

  22. I think Tr Pluto conjunct your Moon or Tr Pluto in hard aspect to your Moon may cause hopeless thinking. Add Tr Saturn to the mix and this may add to depressive thoughts. Hopefully, Tr Jupiter or your natal Jupiter will come to the rescue.

  23. As you indicated in the above post, suicide can be the result of so many different problems. I have been closely touched by suicide both personally and professionally. My brother, ex-partner and one of my best friends all died by suicide, for different reasons. All of which I understand fully, even though I was deeply saddened by their passing. Professionally, I am a mental health worker/ social worker and I deal with people who have suicidal thoughts almost every day. I think it is very important to look at the language we use regarding suicide. Not everyone is aware, however the term “committed suicide” is no a longer politically/ professionally correct term because it has criminal connotations. It is not against the law to take your life. It is more acceptable to say died by suicide or suicided. Also the term successful suicide is no longer used professionally, instead it is completed suicide. There is a great online resource with all this information and more, American Association of Suicidology, https://suicidology.org/

  24. I have given suicide thought quite a few times in my life. Most recent in the last year. However I also know that this too shall pass. If you can get through the darkest hour the sun will shine again.

  25. “If you can get through the darkest hour the sun will shine again” – Yes, I totally agree with Opalina’s quote here.
    My moon-pluto & prominent neptune, have taking me to the depths of despair. Life has taught me, that things can change for the better, just has quick as they did for the worse. Something wonderful may very well be just around the corner, and often is 🌞

  26. I’ve heard ruler of eighth in first and vice versa … others of course, a powerful pluto multiple transits over moon for instance

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