Pluto Transit to the Moon – Mine: The Shadow Side of Women

I was talking to my pal a couple weeks ago. The one that considers the age of someone’s soul. This was before I posted that blog:

“I wrote about you,” I said. “But I didn’t name you. And I don’t know how you feel about that. Sometimes I wonder about this. I haven’t posted the thing yet.”

She told me I could identify her if I wanted.

“Well, I think it depends. If you said something funny, I would credit you. But in this bit I was talking about your beliefs. And completely out of context. I state what you believe without supporting it at all. Or elaborating.

She told me again, I could write whatever I wanted. “If it’s part of me, if I said it, then it’s okay.”

“Well, I don’t know. It would be like you telling a group of people, Elsa is an astrologer and that’s all. Nothing to back that up. Elsa believes in astrology! And that’s all they know. So half of them are going to think I’m a flake. I will be identified by this small piece and nothing else.”

“Yep.”

“And then I walk in the room and everyone has already made a judgment about me,” I said. “Based on virtually nothing.”

“That’s true.”

“And I notice I name the men on my blog, but rarely the women. Of my friends I mean. And I think this is because the women get attacked, where they leave the men alone. The women get hunted.”

“That’s true too.”

“Right. So I am not going to attach some piece of information to you… some belief you have that people will jump on and use to hurt you. Because women get hunted on my blog. There are all kinds of women who hunt other women on my blog and I don’t know why that is. They let the men have some authority but a woman? Forget about it.”

“That’s exactly what happens. It’s pretty sickening.”

“I know. And they hunt me too. On my own blog! As if this is going to do anything,” I laughed. “As if I won’t notice. What do you think the chances of that are? That someone could hunt me on my own blog but I wouldn’t know it?”

She laughed.

“Anyway, this is why I don’t attach your identity. In case you wonder. If there is any way you could be attacked or discredited, that’s exactly what they’ll do so I want to protect you. But this means I can’t credit you properly and I feel bad about it. And I don’t know why the men get to just be. But I know there is something wrong with this. I can pretty much never name a woman friend unless she’s acting totally like a man. And you have to admit it’s a messed up culture. But this is how it is. That bitch is one pound skinnier than me! She has nice hair or something I don’t. What a bitch! Let’s kill her! Let’s string her up! Let’s lie in wait and burn that girl down, the first chance we get. Like a pack of wolves or something.”

“Yep, that’s what they do.”

“And the same women leave the men alone, completely. The men get a whole different level of respect.”

Do you notice this phenomena? Where is the Moon in your chart?

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Pluto Transit to the Moon – Mine: The Shadow Side of Women — 60 Comments

  1. I feel like I’m getting to the party LATE! πŸ˜‰

    Virgo moon, square mars, opp. venus. I didn’t used to have any female friends – only men. I didn’t relate to the competitive body image carping. I still don’t, but am, just the last few years as I’ve gained my OWN physical self-esteem started to see women attack me for eating healthy, exercising and not being overweight. Mostly, it’s a critisism of me in terms of “you look awfully skinny” “you look starved” “you look underweight” “are you eating” Ironically, my BMI is, for the first time since junior high, down to a 25 or so.

    I am financially independent of men and woman, work mostly with men and only “go after” men when they are proposing something blatantly stupid, poorly thought-out, or unsafe in the long run. (These are issues in our decision-making processes). Most of the time I don’t go after men because they won’t listen, don’t hear and aren’t interested in feedback that includes change in their life, thinking or actions -this often happens at work and I’ve found that my “going after them” mostly just alienates them from me, and advice or suggestions I could give.. etc. etc.. Close male friends excepted.

    I rarely go after women because the few women I work with or relate to are highly intelligent, well thought out and often offer better ideas, solutions, and thinking that I could possibly offer. I have a great deal of respect for most of the women I’m associated with. The few that I don’t have any respect for – well I leave them alone. My theory on this – I’ve got way too many other things to deal with in my life than trying to improve someone else. it happens on their own schedule at their own pace. If I’m ASKED for feedback- I give, bluntly, honestly.

    I have lots of casual male friends that I hang out with or talk shop with but only 4 close female friends. Those women are the backbone of my life (not counting family).

    Don’t know what else on this topic. It’s fascinating to read what everyone says. I would agree that men in our culture are passive. I would agree that there are issues here that we rarely deal with in an open and honest manner!!

  2. On the whole media labelling issue:

    For me at least, I tend to label those women who seem to be succombing to the perceived expectations of what other people want as, variously, skanks, bimbos, spineless, &c. (Depending, of course, on what their weakness/es is/are.)

    For example, this past summer a bunch of friends and I went to a convention where costuming plays a big part in the festivities. There were a lot of women in eye-catching costumes, which I could, by observing for only a short while, break into two very general groups: those who were (un)dressed as they were to get attention from others (mostly of the male variety), and those who were (un)dressed as they were because that’s what ~they~ liked.
    Those that seemed to wear what they liked regardless of attention earned kudos from me. Those that I perceived to be in a particular costume only to garner male attention aroused my distaste, for a number of reasons I won’t go into now, and I trash-talked them. Freely. To their face, behind their backs. Loudly!

    And, to be fair, my low self-esteem probably does feed into this. But, I also consider it a feminine weakness that we, as a gender, feel that we need to pander for men’s attention like that. Ergo, women that do this ~are weak~, at least to me.

    (. . .) There’s more I could say on this, but while I was sidetracked by a FTF conversation this train of thought left the station without me. Damn! πŸ˜‰ So, I kinda forgot my original point. I didn’t want to lose what I’d already written, though. Please forgive the abrupt ending.

  3. “But, I also consider it a feminine weakness that we, as a gender, feel that we need to pander for men’s attention like that. Ergo, women that do this ~are weak~, at least to me.”

    I’m curious, SaDiablo. Why do you feel that way? Bc I can tell you, male attention is very nice and it’s not necessarily that easy to get. I say this as someone who is supposedly attractive but who doesn’t do a good job at getting male attention (Moon square Venus, probably). And there comes an age when you begin to lose male attention and, dammit, I hear it hurts and I bet it does.

    Btw, Elsa, I read an interesting letter from an author who says that women’s criticism of other women stems from self-hatred. In other words, there’s such a thing as self-hating women! I don’t know if this is true or not, but it’s certainly an interesting theory bc I do think that women and typically traditionally female interests such as cooking, housekeeping, fashion, tending children, etc. are seen as being frivolous or unimportant. I do think that there’s an idea that powerful women should evolve out of that kind of stuff and go into more powerful fields such as medicine, finance, etc. Anyway, this is probably a digression from your original topic but I do think that we as a society look down on traditional female duties. Even male nurses don’t get much respect! Maybe chefs are the only ones who have a high profile in a traditionally female activity.

  4. It was more a function of the lengths these women would go to, Marly.
    I mean, a woman who ~wants~ to walk around in body paint and a thong wouldn’t have to look to her male friends/attendants for approval, right? But time and again I saw these women do just that, which, combined with non-confident body posture, made me feel like they were “pandering” and aroused my contempt.

    On a seperate-but-related note, I feel that way towards anyone, regardless of gender, who looks for approval *outside* of her/himself first, before considering what s/he truly wants. It’s a human weakness as well, not limited to just females. But, we were talking about the whole feminine thing, so. . . πŸ™‚

  5. I have my moon in Scorpio conjuncted with Uranus. I voted for being more apt to criticize men and give women a pass- but only good women, which, I think is most women, but the bad ones tend to border on evil. Frankly I tend to prefer the company of men, and to just associate with them in general, but should one begin to use his gender as a weapon, well, they will soon have a very dangerous force to reckon with. Me. But I digress…..
    What women in this aggressively patriarchal society need is to band together, not to knock each other down and, especially not to kick our sisters when they’re already down!

  6. Wow! Thanks for all the great comments and stories — I really learned a lot from all of you! My two cents: I didn’t vote because there wasn’t a category that I felt fit me; Scorpio Moon in 2nd House; I read this blog all the time but this is my first contribution; and I agree with those writers who stated most “hunting” originates from feelings of jealousy or insecurity.

    I am not a “hunter,” more of a person who tries to build consensus. What’s interesting is that I’ve been hunted by women and men, but way more men than women have tried to take me out! Personally and professionally. A particularly intense period of that (7 years) is just now drawing to a close. I come from a Native culture indigenous to the northern US, and women aren’t supposed to lead, be brilliant, or do anything to attract attention to ourselves. When we do, we pay for it, and it’s always the men who start the character assassinations. Sure, some women do it too, but mostly we are trying to be supportive of one another. But I’ve drawn the ire of non-Native men too, so maybe it’s not a cultural thing.

    I’d really like to hear your thoughts on this, anyone who cares to comment.

  7. Uummmm.. Well. First of all, lol @ strawberryfields, you big tart! Secondly, I am more critical of other women, but also more encouraging…
    I always felt complete affinity with them, their insecurities, their moods, wants etc. Yet I never felt physically attracted to them, so I figured I was a gay man in a woman’s body.
    Men are fascinating, foreign and ..hard work.
    I have daddy issues so I cannot STAND being ordered around by a man. With regards to your blog Elsa, I must confess as soon as I see ‘Scott blahblahblah, or ‘the soldier blah blah’ I lose intrest, even get a bit annoyed. This is a WOMAN’S place. What we are talking about is secret woman’s business, or it seems that way to me. I don’t really appreciate men being here (unless they are gay) but it is a public forum and I have no control so I just have to suck it up and get over it πŸ™‚

  8. Leo moon & don’t ‘hunt’ at all! Its taken people doig it to me for me to realise it exists- bit strange as I would’ve thought a leo moon q. competive but it is in the 8th house – cancer cusp

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