Love And Delusion: People Who Want To Marry You When They Don’t Even Like You…

love valentine
This is in honor of the current sky where Venus in Leo opposes Neptune and Jupiter in Aquarius which is very similar to the energy in my natal chart. The text below is from February 2009 and requires no update.

I claimed, correctly, that at least forty men had proposed to me in my life. Bella asked on Venus Neptune Getting Married:

What is the astrology for that level of proposal mania?

I stated I had to dodge weddings as if they were bullets and I am reposting this because it takes on a new meaning when you have the back story.

For the record, my first marriage proposal came when I was 12 years old… there were two of them actually, there was a competition going and it was horrendous. My most recent proposal came 2 days ago, and not from the soldier.

I will explain this in text in another post but here is the old video. You will see I am emphatic in it and this is because people have been trying to marry my hologram since puberty and it is completely exasperating. I am mistaken for a “wife” more often than I am mistaken as a “whore” or an “alcoholic” a “bad parent” etc. and that is staying something!

I’m a control freak magnet! This is what happens when you have Uranus in the 7th (love at first sight) and Venus square Neptune on the midheaven (Delusion!!).
Er… excuse my fervor but I just don’t like suntan pantyhose…

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Love And Delusion: People Who Want To Marry You When They Don’t Even Like You… — 70 Comments

  1. Elsa,

    This video is one of the most powerful posts any healthy human could make, especially in these days of wishy washy new agey sheep mentality.

    The smiling depressives are surely threatened by people with your passion. You Go, Gold Hat!

    does pluto transit 12th figure here?

  2. “Why don’t you find somebody you like and leave me the hell alone?”

    YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Nail on the head, Elsa.

  3. “does pluto transit 12th figure here?”

    4tuna – I don’t think so. I have been this pissed off about this for many years… like a dozen or maybe 15. That little rant is yet the tip of the iceberg what I have to say on this subject! πŸ™‚

  4. LOL this is so good!
    What a mess in those guys’ heads and all because of you πŸ˜‰

    Well, I was raised by two Gemini and I was always able to speak my mind. Yet, I can see myself trying to adjust to what somebody else would want me to be, as sad as it feels to say it. I wouldn’t change if they told me to, but I’d try if I felt that’s what they wanted. I still have a lot to grow on these issues obviously.

    Rationally I find it ridiculous and even impossible. It’s similar to the “not that into you” situation. Those men needed to understand that you were not what they idealized and move on to a more appropriate situation.

  5. I don’t shave my legs in the winter because what’s the point? I wear pants and I don’t have a significant other. However, you’d never believe how many people get deeply offended by this! Like, “WHAT? Gross?! Why don’t you shave your legs!? You should shave your legs!” Well, no I don’t want to. Their my legs, you can’t even see them so what’s the hang up. I don’t get why women have such issues with body hair, it’s like a moral issue for most of them, especially other people’s. lol.

  6. Question, if you don’t mind, Elsa (and everyone else):

    You talked about the 7th house and projection a few weeks ago. And the 7th house also reflects what people project on us?

  7. Yaaay!!! Way to go, Elsa!!

    As someone with Uranus in the 7th & trine both Sun & Moon, I have spent my life insisting on being me. Having lots of Libra, I was more polite about it but am extremely stubborn. Like spending a year at college in a program my mom pushed, proving I could do it, then returning to what I wanted to do in the first place, ignoring the protests. πŸ™‚

  8. Oh, sorry, I misunderstood. I saw ‘Uranus in the 7th House’, missed ‘Venus square Neptune (Delusion!!)’. πŸ˜›

    I guess the control freak’s controlling tendencies would show in his/her chart then. But that doesn’t explain why they are drawn to you… rather than project their delusions on someone else? (Maybe they do?)

  9. This made me laugh out loud. I love the things you come out with. “Why don’t you find somebody you like and leave me the hell alone?”… great stuff, Elsa!

  10. Any man who is vocally pro-suntan-pantyhose is going to be a gigantic bummer in a matter of weeks if not days. Run don’t walk. Same with any guy who cares about someone shaving her legs more than having fun at dinner w/her. God! As if any of us have enough time to worry about this kind of stuff.

    I love this video!

    This video is so funny & inspiring–I like that makes the idea of plasticizing oneself clearly as stupid & ridiculous as it actually is. Thank you.

  11. I had to get rid of that hat about 13 years ago and I am still somewhat sad about it… along with this one pair of boots I thought I was too mature for.

    ::laughs::

    I was so wrong about that.

  12. this really hits home to my venus/neptune “they don’t want to let go of the fantasy of who i might be if only i wasn’t me”

    i’m still working my head around realizing that the fact i wasn’t *whoever they thought i was* doesn’t mean there was something wrong with me (that i wouldn’t change, sorry.)

    anyway. the point packs a punch. thanks.

  13. Preach it!

    When I was young, I married a guy who, I found out three months into the marriage, wanted a sweet petite blonde wife with a tiny little ass. Guess what? I’m tall, built like an Amazon, had flaming red hair at the time, and my moneymaker gives you two hands full and change. Nor am I all that sweet at times. Why did this man marry me?? Was it Uranus in the 7th? We spent a year in couples therapy and the therapist never once addressed that he was trying to change me into something I wasn’t. She framed it into objectification, sex addiction, etc., and dragged it out for ages. I fixed it myself and walked.

    So here’s to the gold hat gals. Elsa got her man and so can we.

  14. Love it! This Aries rising and Leo Sun/Mars never believed in toning down who she was for anyone.

    I’ve had the same problem over the years, and I suspect it’s the projecting as well. These guys see the Libra DSC (I also have three planets in Libra, including the Moon), and think I’m this sweet, quiet, well-spoken thing. I am that, but it’s only one part of me. A lot of them were like, “Where did this feistiness come from?” when they got to know me. I always said, if you don’t like it, walk. Saved me a lot of grief. πŸ˜‰

  15. That’s hilarious, Elsa! Sounds like a dangerous placement!

    Charlotte, hah. I used to be embarrassed in 6th grade that I didn’t shave my legs. I am so puzzled by American attitudes about non-hirsuteness and body image. Particularly (thank god you can say “taboo” things on this blog) the debate about shaving one’s private parts.

    My Aquarius mom tells me people are different/you can’t change anyone or rather don’t place anyone on the Procrustian bed all the time, but it hasn’t been drilled into me yet. I feel like I should be annoyed by it.
    I’m annoyed like crazy with my Aquarian friend who got mad when I used the word “don’t” in this context: “Don’t tell this secret to anybody else.” She asked me if I think friends should be obedient like dogs. It’s idiotic to rebel for no reason. I said that because she would betray me if she didn’t. I’m not the man, she gains nothing by sticking it to me. Grr, sometimes Uranian attitudes can be extreme to the point of stupidity. To the point when my friend is no longer on my team.
    At the same time, I get pissed when someone is limited by authority figures. Particularly when parents make a child be something out of vanity or “knowing what’s best for them” and they just meekly go along.

  16. ‘If you don’t like me, go away and leave me alone’?

    Lord, the number of times I’ve said that.

    max
    [‘But I have Uranus in the 11th, natch.’]

  17. AVERY:

    I’m tall, built like an Amazon, had flaming red hair at the time, and my moneymaker gives you two hands full and change.

    ^^^^ I LOVED YOUR POST! I LOOK THE WAY YOU DESCRIBE BUT I DON’T HAVE RED HAIR. LOVED THE MONEYMAKER COMMENT. BRILLIANT πŸ™‚

  18. As for me, men ALWAYS want to change me but I don’t know where I can find this in my chart. I was brought up with negative critical parents so, unfortunately, have always caved into these pressures. Probably explains why I end up horribly depressed in nearly every relationship I’ve been in!!!

  19. This never happens to me…probably because if anyone tries to put their two bits in about ‘what I should be’ I resist resist resist…I resist by leaving. In about 2 seconds flat.

    To quote Mr T…pity the fool. (Taurus Sun opposed Uranus MC)

    Oh yeah, and lest I forget: my SO is exactly the same: we both hate being told what to do. So here is the key, no? Find yourself a maverick? πŸ˜‰

  20. Krista, maybe it could be a lot of second house action in a chart, issues about self worth — which I thnk can heal just by hanging out on Elsa’s blog, a self esteem oasis.

  21. I don’t think that first guy really saw Yellow and purple Elsa. He saw his suntan panty hose fantasy and something in him assumed you would play that out for him. It interesting with Neptune on the angle with Venus aspect. I know one lovely lady with Neptune (in scorpio) on the ascendant and Venus in tenth.

    Whenever she went to a restaurant the waitress always got her order incorrect. She gave up just accepting the wrong meal and instead of eating it, she sent it back. In fact she eventually would make a point to the waiter about her order, you know, looked him in the eye in the here and now. It seems that unless she clinked a glass or clapped her hands before ordering the waiter would be off in narna narna land with his or her fantasy, like being in a different reality. Interesting stuff indeed.

    kingsley

  22. Elsa this was fantastic! I havent had a chance to watch all the videos yet so Im catching up but this had me in stitches. And I loved how you said everything in this video so passionately and loud.

    “Why dont you find someone you like and leave me the hell alone”

    This one is a classic. Im totally showing this to video to mum, shes going to get a crack outta this.

  23. ROFL. I rarely laugh out loud when I am doing blogs, but this did it. The thing about the lady not being dead was funny, but this one got the laugh out loud.

  24. My husband and I have a composite uranus in 7th…it looked like a summer fling with a shipwrecked foreigner…but here we are, 14 years later against the odds (and what odds!!)
    Do we like each other? Most of the time, maybe itΒ΄s that 11th house composite sun.

  25. I will have to remember that phrase and use it often, “Why don’t you find someone you like and leave me alone?” (adding a few expletives). My second husband decided we were preppy people (the 90’s) so he literally bought my clothes that I was allowed to wear and controlled the money and everything else. When he met me I was wearing a coral cotton skirt and sneakers, I’m half asian and he wanted us to be Irish! He’s not even really Irish, just a wannabe. After I married him hesitantly and found myself in this pickle, I thought to myself, why me? I can’t fathom the rest of my life going to Irish bars and listening to the same songs over and over and over (the beer is fine though). Just go find a blue eyed blond to play this game with you and leave me alone. But I didn’t say that and I should have. That marriage wasn’t easy to get out of….My first husband thought I was a lesser on the intellectual realm because I never talked or communicated to him. HE DID ALL THE TALKING ALL THE TIME, IT WAS ALL ABOUT HIM AND OFCOURSE HE WAS ALWAYS RIGHT. It’s all so funny now! I am much more aware now and will never let this happen again. I take responsibility for my part and lesson learned.

  26. “Hell no, I can’t keep it down, I’m Italian!”

    Elsa, I can’t help it but I LOVED that statement πŸ˜‰ I’ve been told SO MANY TIMES in my life I NEED to keep it down. I came from a loud Asian family myself and most of the time I’ve dated guys who are expecting some softspoken Asian girl! hahah… I just thought this resonated with me so well! πŸ™‚

    Thanks making my day so far πŸ˜‰

  27. Ok – I see how that can happen now! Very inspiring video – reminds me of when you told me to be the tallest poppy in the field. There will be one person somewhere who can cope with my ‘knife’ and they need to be able to see me! Authenticity feels so bloody good.

  28. wow i didn’t notice it at first but your face reminds me of a libra sun i know with venus in leo. πŸ™‚ something about the eyes and the nose, its quite distinct

  29. kashmiri-yeah, his family was Brittish, German, Scottish,lol. This is how I realized that he was creating false images and lying even when there was no need to do so. Then when he started demanding that I too back up his lies, I knew i was he end and that I had made a terrible mistake. After divorcing he decided to start telling our kids that since they were not baptized they would to hell and weren’t they afraid of going to hell? Ofcouse these things went on during his annual, yes annual, visitations and the kids basically said, “No – we are not afraid of going to hell”. Then they just laughed at him. I was so proud of them. The fear of going to hell is a big one to overcome.

  30. I’ve had one marriage proposal and it wasn’t the man I married. it wasn’t really a proper proposal– he had a ring but he didn’t actually ASK me; he just kind of offered the ring. he was doing it because I was leaving the country and he didn’t want to lose me.

    the man I actually married it was more of an ongoing conversation/arrangement without an actual proposal.

    a proper proposal with a ring would be nice. ::sigh::

  31. never had a marriage proposal. some weird “i would marry you if [something impossible in present spacetime]” and “if you were my wife…” but no actual offers.

    maybe they’re scared. who knows…

  32. Wow. Never had one. But if I ever get one, I’d like it proper πŸ™‚

    “Hell no, I can’t keep it down, I’m Italian!”
    LOL. I have the opposite problem. Mercury in Pisces conjunct mc

  33. Good for you for being so strong, although it sounds like it was natural for you to do so. I spent a large part of my life trying to live up to what I thought men wanted me to be. Venus square Saturn. It’s taken me a long time to stand up and just be me, and to own it and let men think what they want. It was easy with women…I couldn’t care less what they thought, but men was a tough nut to crack.

  34. Aw, i love the emotion in this video! I can relate, though it’s not the being proposed to part (i’ve only been proposed to once, by a man on a busstop who i think was in dire need of a greencard). I have Neptune in the 6th square my Pisces MC and people want me to be all kinds of stuff but never seem to see who i am, or what i’m about. They like to dump their shit on me too, especially in the workplace and especially bosses. I have this happening to me now, and it’s daunting, is all i can say.

  35. This is perfection. Just perfection. I was engaged at 19,23,and 26. Thank God I waited to get married.(The aged 26 proposal was the one that took).

    The man I was engaged to at 26 wanted to remake me. It didn’t happen πŸ™‚ He is remarried and still miserable.

  36. This is sososo goood. This should be downloadable on mp3…just so one could listen to it over and over and make ur friends listen to it:)

  37. I also have Uranus in the 7th and Venus square Neptune conj Midheaven. I’ve been proposed to four times. I reluctantly married twice – and divorced twice. I am honest about who I am and actually love being a wife. Both “men,” and I use that term loosely, turned on me like I had trapped them into marriage – and THEY were the ones who INSISTED on marrying me! I still don’t understand it. Also, I love to plan my imaginary wedding online and watch the wedding shows – I just can’t stand the thought of actually having one. I did not want anyone at either of my weddings. I don’t like to be stared at, and people just complain about your dress, food, venue ANYWAY. If I get married again, it’s going to be on a cruise ship or on a beach barefoot – eloping!

  38. Oh…I saw this in 2008 and had a long ponder about why it is that when men see my Neptune I feel completely reponsible and very badly that I am not meeting their expectations. Because I know what it is, mostly — there’s some dustmote in a sumbeam that glances off something shiny in a room and somehow makes me look like the best, most amazing woman they’ve ever seen, and for some reason that makes me want to sort of meeet the challenge and be that person. When the illusion explodes I feel guilty.

    But I was grounded enough to keep trying to reach agreement with the last guy that I wasn’t who he was looking for. It took him eight years to give up and admit that. He literally spent years apprehending whatever self esteem I had about my true, good, serviceable qualities and ripping it apart like cobwebs, by the handful.

    He still calls me all the time because we’re “friends”. What a waste of my life.

  39. My Pisces in Venus and Cancer Rising can translate into men wanting to “wife me up” after a few dates. Fortunately, my Cap moon is there to keep me line. These guys do not like my independent spirit (a la Aries sun). But, they seem to sense the vulnerability underneath and WHAM! they are on bended knee rushing my down the aisle. The latest instance of this occurred with my ex. He is an Aqua Sun, Scorp Rising, Cap Moon with a Venus in Cap. He broke our engagement by text message and then refused to pick up his stuff for five months. On top of which, he would drunk dial me at least once a month. He is still probably fuming because I refused to participate in his mind games. Perhaps, I should just stick with other Fire Signs. lol

  40. Thanks, Elsa. I love this website. Reading the blogs got me through a very rough patch of last year’s Venus in Retrograde and the current Saturn in Retrograde which is throwing out lessons to me like a clown car in the parade. πŸ™‚

  41. Just stumbled on this video right now and I have to say you lit up some major light bulbs in my mind with this one!! Now I get it, I really do get it! πŸ™‚

  42. Yes, yes, and yes! I have a 12th house Venus in Aries trine Neptune H8 and….boy do men (ahem, boys) get offended when I open my mouth, and they realize the fantasy doll not only can speak, but she’s smarter than them. *innocent look* I know, I’m really humble about it. πŸ˜‰

    Men tend to act out the negative Aries traits when the mirror is shattered. They react with childish pouts, sulks, and whiny words about how mean I am. Aww, poor baby–scram! If you can’t see me for who I am, I don’t wish to see you anymore. Venus/Saturn despises wasting precious time.

    But I’m glad I found this video, and loved what you said Elsa as it makes perfect sense to me. And I’ve been experiencing the same thing for about fifteen years now. Le sigh….humans. ; )

  43. I’d just like to say that I absolutely loved the video. I don’t have this particular aspect, but the way you described it Elsa was so entertaining/interesting πŸ™‚

  44. I have Venus in Taurus opposite Neptune and square Saturn (and Jupiter) with a Pisces Moon in the 8th and Uranus in the 1st. Major delusions in relationships up until a year ago ( I am 50 now) haha

    Throw in a SN-Chiron conjunction in Pisces in the 7th house and that Mars-Uranus-Pluto-NN in the 1st and I have had one hell of a learning curve in the area of self vs losing myself in others.

    My Mom has an Aquarius Moon that made sure I wouldn’t become overly attached to her emotional as well.

  45. OMG awesome video, Elsa! I love it!

    I’ve gotten the push to be more “professional”, less chatty with strangers (I have an excellent antenna for trouble, so, I can take care of myself), less revealing clothes (I’m a Virgo stellium, Cap Venus, really???), etc. Maybe Neptune in 3H gives off illusions, sextiling my first house planets. Who knows.

    How do I deal with it? Still coming to terms with that. I just end up,surprising people by doing what I want in the end. Don’t want me to get tattoos? Too bad. At my age, I’m not going to be heading any Fortune 500 company so who care. Getting another on my big birthday next year.

  46. I don’t think you are a freak magnet… because if you are one, then I am too. I’ve also met plenty of weirdos telling me they want to be with me but asking me to get a tan cause I’m too white, and to get a boob job cause my breasts are too small, and to turn my hair blond cause mine is brown, and to wear contact lens to get blue eyes cause mine are brown, and the list goes on. So now the first thing I do when I meet someone is ask them if there is anything they wish to change about me. Maybe most men are strange nowadays. Or maybe the normal ones are already married.
    Thinking of it however, I have Moon square Venus and I’ve read somewhere because of that I am likely to be attracted to and to attract people that are not good for me. Do you have that too?

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