Neptune & The Saint / Sinner Phenomena

Neptune gorgeousWith Neptune conjunct my Midheaven, people often throw me up as some kind of saint. Then I blink, or they blink and I come crashing down to sinner.

I’m not talking about this blog though it happens here as well.  I’m talking about my personal life where I am see as, great, Great, GREAT, and then it flips on me and I become the curse from hell.

This is no fun for me but as I’ve gotten older, I’ve learned that time is good to me. A person who decided I was horrible will see things differently, eventually. I wind up elevated again?

It’s better to go from saint to sinner and back to saint, then it is to go from sinner to saint and back to sinner which also happens!

In reality, I am just a human being, gifted and flawed like everyone else. But having Neptune prominent, distorts this.

I think Pisces rising has to deal with this… Virgo rising as well, to some extent.  Neptune conjunct the ascendant or descendent will also do it.  Neptune messing with Venus is also implicated.

If you’ve got Neptune emphasized, are you seen as saint first and sinner later, or the other way around?  Also, which position do you assign other first, typically? 

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Neptune & The Saint / Sinner Phenomena — 22 Comments

  1. Neptune in the 10th here too; though not conjunct the MC, it is opposed Mars. I am also a Sun Pisces conjunct Jupiter. For a long time it seemed like people just thought I was ‘in another world’, ‘out there’ or ‘space cadet’. For a while I was the poet and dreamer, then the psychic, then a long chapter of being spiritually ambitious. Now I am just the quiet lady who meditates and walks a lot.

    I’m not really aware of being cast as saint or sinner but I wouldn’t be surprised if that’s how others thought of me. I do have the sense of having disappointed people a lot. Being a disappointment.

    • “I do have the sense of having disappointed people a lot. Being a disappointment.”

      I can relate to this. It’s where, “let’s not and say we did”, comes from. Because I can see through the veil, where it’s headed. Spare both parties the (traumatic) experience because it is traumatic in my view, or at least, needlessly painful.

  2. My dad had a favorite saying, “Shit on a pedestal is still shit!”
    What I eventually got from that is, if you think of yourself as shit, no matter what you accomplish, you’ll still have to contend with your low level of self worth and never really be able to enjoy life when it is good. You’ll distrust the people who genuinely love you because you you don’t love yourself. I have Neptune 4H trine Pluto 2H.

  3. Neptune conjuct my MC , ascendant leo,
    I go from saint to sinner.
    From peacemaker to bat outta hell.
    And then the quiet saint.
    Hahaha.
    I am trying to control the otherside.
    But I do get ratty and batty from time to time.
    Most times its for a reason, but now I am trying to control my reaction time.
    Your teachings have helped me see ,sides of myself I never looked at or acknowledged.
    Thank you for helping me grow up.
    ???

  4. hm i do get this i suppose but it comes to a time in my life where i dont give a shit what others think. if i stress myself out all the time what others think i’ll never feel good. I just gotta do whats best and how much power i can handle. if i can’t handle it, then i can’t and just believe and pray to God everything will be fine. thats all that i can do. i am trying to help a few people with alot of libra or libra in their charts to not care about what others think. they extend alot of their pleasing others to the point it kills them. basically takes so much of their power that they die inside. so i try very hard to tell them because i love these people to stop caring what others think and remember that they themselves need to take care of themselves first or they can’t take care of others. so stand up for yourself, despite if others say they are mean or horrible horrible things and say hey i’m only human and you would never want this for yourself, ‘why you making me suffer and extend myself’ kind of thing. so basically dont give a shit and take care of self first. pray and still be good person and hope for the best.

    • that could be my sun in 1st house talking though. the selfishness, but it needs to be balanced. for my own self worth i want to be less selfish but not too selfish either. i wont feel good. the main thing is to feel good about ‘self’

    • I get this and agree with you. But in my case, it’s always about my reputation which impacts the entire structure of my life. Sucks for Cap rising… but I have the Saturn Neptune theme repeated in my chart. I don’t think I can avoid it. There is always a big investment of some kind… and the solid accomplishment or credibility or whatever, simply disappears.

      • @elsa, i’m wondering if cancer your opposite capricorn can help with that. i just can’t figure out how they help with capricorn’s need for reputation to be respected at all times. It’s kind of like libra for being ‘ liked’ so they dont step on toes. (which aries their opposite does not out of malice but out of their childlike bumblingness).

        • Well, I don’t have that need.
          This has gone on since I was a small child. I mean, I spent my entire childhood with black eyes, bruises, and belt welts, open and bleeding, where my clothing would stick to them.

          I got a pair of shoes, once a year, which I fully outgrew by summer time. Lived barefooted in the desert, with my feet cracked, working outside all day. So hey! My entire life is humiliating on some level. “What people think” has been irrelevant to me since I was about six years old.

          Now I do have a need to pay my bills! I have been homeless. I do not care to repeat that, so when someone goes after my livelihood or harms my children – these things matter.

          But yeah. I went to a giant Fleetwood Mac concert – first time ever in a stadium. Both eyes, blackened. Face swollen to all hell from being beaten. I couldn’t have cared less. I mean, that was my last beating. I knew this deep down and I was in complete bliss.

          You see what I mean? I had no shame about this. That’s not to say it’s not annoying. But I don’t need people to think certain things about me at all. This has done on so long, it’s like watching cars slid off the road to land in a ditch. I can’t stop that from happening. I’m not the one driving the car.

          • @Elsa, its always so tragic and sad when i read about your childhood, no child should ever go through that, and parents who beat their children in my eyes, i think they have an inborn “fear” and their fears are projected on their children and they want to control so much they lost the ability to love and let go. Sorry if its analyzing too much, but im just writing this in a ” general” sense because personally i think that comes from fear. why these parents or elders or guardians do this. fear is saturnian too, strongly so and malefic. Some fear is good like dont go through a red light because you’ll get into an accident and hurt others and yourself, thats more common sense fear i guess. But projecting fear onto your children because they dont know how to control so they lose control. i’m definitely not good at analzying this but just trying to make sense of it all.
            In alot of your writing you are happy and jupiterian, and its good you always have a positive outlook in life. I think thats also due to your belief system and good heart ^^
            thanks for having this blog for all of us to read and learn.

            • “…i think they have an inborn “fear” and their fears are projected on their children and they want to control so much they lost the ability to love and let go.”

              Or psychopathy…

              • thats exactly what my husband would say, just would call them psychopaths. its that simple. for me i’m trying to make sense of it all. but some people just have mental disorder or some kind of disconnect to empathy.
                it reminds me of when my capricorn mother in law was a social worker, many years ago and she told us this story of a farming couple who had several children and they recently had a baby, and they were always being called in for child services abuse; the father was waking up the baby and never letting the baby sleep. his answer was, ” he kept waking us in the middle of the night crying so i poked at him so he wouldnt sleep either.” that was so disturbing. I dont know what happened to them but i hoped that child care services took them away or helped in some way.

  5. All day- every day lately. Though I am learning to just bob and float rather than always try to swim against the tides and convince people I am not the thing they think I am. It just gets too exhausting

  6. Neptune conjunct Sun, Neptune in the 2nd H.. For a long, long time I had no idea what I was, where I was and why all this senseless pain coming from a senseless world was coming from. I also am going through what I call ‘Neptune’s mantle over my Skyes'(opposition to ascendant and square the Midheaven). I am fighting (to no avail) to clear the fog, but more and more layers of it keep coming. What is true, what is false, I have absolutely no idea. I have learned to live in this fragile state of complete Oneness and non-labeling.It’s like I am and I am not, at the same time. Some say it’s Nirvana (sainthood) others say it’s losing grip on Sanity (‘sinner’)..

  7. Saint. At school I would sometimes instigate trouble because I liked to stir the pot. I sorta said look at this bomb I’ve got and let someone else light the fuse while I sat back and watched the explosion. Not once did I get any comeback. Same when I started working. I have instigated rebellion, not denied my part in it though not spelled it out, but people still looked at me like butter wouldn’t melt. Neptune and Venus on the MC, sextile Jupiter. I am now of an age where I don’t do this type of thing (lol) but I know I can. In my later mature years I’ve either remained a saint or I go from saint to permanent sinner. No flip back to saint. People see what they want to see.

      • yeah, i dont mean it to come across as being proud of it, just something I was unconscious of when I was young but now conscious of and I’m very honest with myself. I choose harmony these days!

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