Libra Woman Is In Love With Virgo Man

librastat

Dear Elsa,

I am a Libra in love with a Virgo man. We have such a strong connection. I thought everything was going great, until he turned around and said that we lived too far apart (1.5 hours) and it would never work.

I am so upset because things were so good and fantastic between us, but he said it was too difficult being so far apart. I asked why not give it a chance and see, and he said he was already attached and didn’t want to get more attached and hurt. I haven’t called him even though I really want to but I figure he would call me if he was interested.

Should I move on and see what else is out there… or just keep pining for a love it seems I can’t have??

Libra in Love

Dear Libra,

Well I suppose you’ll move on eventually because he’s not coming to you, nor is he asking you to come to him. So really, it’s like the whole team has gone home and you’re still standing there on the mound, wondering…

Apparently you’re wondering how he could opt out when everything was so grand and here is the little bit you’re missing. It wasn’t grand for him! Whatever it was, but it was not ‘good and fantastic” as you describe it, at least not from his perspective and looking in this direction will lead you to the door out.

Instead of going on and on in your mind pining for this great thing you lost, try to stand in his shoes. Try to hear what he is telling you; if not in words then by the choice he’s made. Your relationship was something to him, but not enough for him to want to continue to invest.

Don’t miss the important thing here, which is this: your reality of something is not necessarily going to jibe with another person’s read on things. You have Venus conjunct Neptune in your chart, famous for pining but this is another manifestation of the same aspect. You fantasize and blur the loved one to such a degree that you have no idea who they are and how they feel.

I imagine this hurts, and I’m sorry about that. But from a fellow Venus Neptune who’s learned the hard way, I can tell you for sure that you will have to look at these tendencies at some point – if you want to be part of a relationship that is actually “good and fantastic”… for both parties.

Good luck.

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Comments

Libra Woman Is In Love With Virgo Man — 45 Comments

  1. Neptune sextile Venus here… who recently gave up a 1.25 hour away relationship… although, as above, the distance was not the main issue.

  2. I’ve felt something I think may be similar before with 1 particular break-up. After it didn’t work out, I read every freakin relationship book I could lay my hands on & also asked Elsa’s advice. I have an aspect in my chart that is somewhat similar to the poster’s.

    So please don’t think of this quote as talking down to anyone in any way. I’m posting it b/c it was something I read during that time that really resonated with me & helped me – so I just spent some quality time on google to find it again:
    “”This is going to be controversial, but I am going to say it anyway. No matter how powerful and real your feelings may be for someone, if that person cannot fully and honestly return them and therefore actively love you back, these feelings mean nothing. Sure, they may feel powerful, deep, mythic in scope and proportion. You may “never ever have felt this way before.” But who cares? If the person you “love” cannot freely spend his days thinking about you and being with you, it’s not real love.””

  3. I don’t know that it wasn’t as good for him, he sounds like men I’ve known with Saturn or Pluto with the Moon or Venus. Expectation of loss.

    A lot of men spend a lot time making up reasons why a relationship won’t work. These are defense mechanisms. Then, when the relationship doesn’t work, they’re proven right. While he might actually be *thrilled* to hear from you, he’s a man who will fulfill his own prophecy.

    A ‘self fulfilling prophecy man’ is only worth your time when he places as more emphasis on LOVE than PAIN. Otherwise, you’re going to spend a lot of your time reassuring him (which can be very intoxicating, but tiring, for Venus-Neptune), and he’s *never* going to be the kind of person to reciprocate equally.

    Why do you want that kind of guy back? That’s a love to share with a young child, not a partner.

    (women do this too)

    ~C [Venus in Pisces – in aspect to Neptune.]

    PS to all pining Neptune, Piscean, 12th house types:

    When the question is “should I keep pining?” the answer for future happiness is ALWAYS NO. Pining is not good. Never good. It is addictive and destructive. I could write a book. Stop it. Try. Please.

    Once you stop – you’ll have a chance to realize pining is a rather unpleasant feeling. One you are more attached to than reality. And, while you’re pining, all kinds of real opportuinites for a wider spectrum of emotions are probably PASSING YOU BY.

    Also-
    If you have the inclination to pine, it helps to have other things to do. Busy people don’t pine, their minds are occupied by more than romantic daydreaming. Use your capacity for idealization, fantasy and memory polishing to change your art of living. Time marches on…flow with it.

    Write a poem.
    Take a picture.
    Make art.
    Help others.
    Read a book.
    Do something.
    Anything.

    Never pine.

    But don’t feel bad when you do, it will happen, just begin again with what’s real NOW. Again. And again. And again.

  4. What strange advice CC; some of the best art (poetry, music, painting etc)is the result/inspired by/an expression of …pining.

    The world would be poorer without the romantic daydreamers and art as a means to keep busy and your mind off other things is not how it works.

  5. Hi Tosh,
    There’s actually a slight (or huge) difference between longing, an inspirational emotion, and pining, an action which produces nothing.

    The definition of pining is “Languishing; drooping; wasting away”

    This doesn’t sound like artistic inspiration, does it?

    Now an occasional synonym for pining is longing:

    “A strong persistent yearning or desire, especially one that cannot be fulfilled.”

    It is very difficult to pine and do anything else at the same time. Its a diffuse mindstate. Art making requires a concentration or a ‘trance’ state known as flow. Pining is a form of unconcentrated daydreaming, which is definitely not inspiration. Longing for a perfect one, like Dante’s Beatriz, may only be glimpsed for a moment, becoming the muse for a lifetime’s work. This is not pining. Pining is destructive, as the definition says. In my expereince ist is also addictive, but elaborating how these states of mind become cyclic are not appropriate for a blog comment.

    Meditation is excellent for the chronically unfocused and dissatisfied mind of such a creative type, for it makes room to percieve the subtler dimensions of being/flow. To be disciplined yet unlimited at the same time.

    Art/meditation/service/spirituality are the classic modes of high expression of for PI/NE/12. But the piners, drift aimlessly, or feel sorry for themselves, or end up addicted. Piners may make art, but what about the rest of that short list?

    Pining is a sort of suspended animation, quite distinct from ‘divine discontent’. When there is no pining for something more, better, or past, these negative factors express as a dissatisfied perfectionism(like the Pisces Moon from apr27). Nothing is quite good enough, close enough or real enough. And nothing ever gets created but unfulfilling dreams.

    Dreams made real are the province of art, divine discontent and longing.

    These sort of semantic differences are important to me. I’m trained as a writer and art historian. As an astrological counsellor with all 3 of these factors (Pi/Ne/12), I am all too aware of distinct differences in expression(and the sort of art they result in, and the audience for such work).

    If you go back to the older “Scott” threads you’ll have a chance to read more about my philosophy of emotions, astrology and art.

    If you disagree, I’m more than happy to consider your philosophy/theory/vocabulary of ‘how it works’.

  6. Wow CC! You really like to write!
    I Googled ‘pining’ and went by definition #1(your ‘occasional’ one) and I didn’t get as far as definition # 3, the one you used; hence our differences.
    But, whatever…I would love to know your philosophies of emotions, astrology and art….now I am curious how much they may differ from my own.
    As for art making……sometimes it does require a ‘trance’ state…when and after ‘the idea/inspiration’ hits you, but more often it requires exactly what I wrote….and that is doing nothing…..aimlessly wandering with your thoughts…daydreaming with no purpose…..or feeling pain…or feeling hurt….or just plain ‘pining’ …….as in ‘wasting away’…as in ‘sinking’ deeper than ever.
    CC you may be a writer and an art historian, but I am an artist and an architect and know only too well what is needed to get me ‘going’. BTW, I have never been addicted to anything but the Net.
    What I didn’t like in your comment was the distinction that you made at the start, separating male and female reactions or feelings and then the impression I got that you seem to think there is a need to always be ‘productive’.
    Funny, must be because of all my air elements…not grounded at all…but for me life is about experiencing feelings, emotions, whatever kind, and not just producing or doing something always with a purpose.

  7. CC, I read your previous comments (Scott) and I do agree with most of what you said; I don’t want you to misunderstand that I think that there must be pain for great art.
    Something that you said here bothered me and that’s why I posted, I’ll figure it out…eventually.

  8. Hi CC – there is a quality in your words that pushes people away from you. i am glad you are here – Elsa is a craftsman in using words to connect people and i am learning immensely from her as well.
    Don

  9. I disagree about CC using words to push people away. I may not like what she’s saying about pining (I, too, have PI/Ne/12) but I can’t disagree with it. Maybe I don’t like it bc it hits home. My pining has gotten me NOTHING. I am not wasting away (only bc I can’t imagine skipping meals, hello, Cancer rising!) but I’m definitely stuck in a weird Groundghog Day kinda feeling about my life. Anyway, CC, I’d like to know if it’d be okay to email you privately bc I like your comments. Or you can email me at emekah02 at yahoo.

  10. Hi Tosh,
    You wrote: “What I didn’t like in your comment was the distinction that you made at the start, separating male and female reactions or feelings ”

    Here’s what I originaly wrote
    “Why do you want that kind of guy back? That’s a love to share with a young child, not a partner.

    (women do this too)”

    Obviously, I was very clear, but not quite clear enough, about the fact that defensive behavior was not gender specific i.e. “(women do this too)”.

    As far the conclusions you drew about my relationship to productivity, I see, but that comment was specific with regard to pining. As far as the ‘time out’ (Pi/Ne/12) certainly needs, watching tv or film, basic spaciness, tuning out and introspecting are appropriate and either healthy or unhealthy. It all about proportion, and maintaining some groudedness. This is certainly a matter of opinion.

    I’ve also continued to think about pining and art. Van Gogh pined over a prostitute. He cut of an ear and sent it to her, but never painted her. That’s pining for you. I’ve got a Michelangelo anecdote, if you want one. He was ridiculously productive, especially because of Papal commissions, but late in life he *longed* for Tommaso Cavalieri, and drew him when he had the time.

    I see where you are at. Meditation *is* actually productive, as is dance, art or music making. All definitely the province of those with fairly integrated Saturn themes. Admittedly, I do not own a tv. It is fine for you not to like my writing or astrological counsel, and have an interest in debating it. Its fine for you not to agree with my belief that recreation is productive (though not a part of ‘an economy’).

    Thanks for reading the comments on art and angst. From a Heideggarian perspective angst could be as ‘good’ as longing, or as ‘bad’ as pining, but I made a point about how it works. Isn’t it interesting that Scorpio themes that emerged in that discussion of Scott, Beethoven and angst.

    Anyway, I turned down an opportunity to be trained as an architect many Moons ago, because if any profession is egregiously gender biased in the 21st century its architecture. Architecture is sublimely Saturnine.

    PS: In my opinion pining inspires a whole lot of mediocre art, but its the making that matters to the individual. Also, I bother people, I have a powerful and disruptive horoscope. According to the plethora of Sc/8/Pl types I attract, I am also ‘mysterious’, so you may not quite put your finger on that ‘bother’.

    Yes, I like to write.
    I have something to say.
    Good times.
    ______________________

    Hi Don,
    There is a quality to my words that attracts appropriate people to me. One of the best things about being a skilled astrologer is the ability to see through personal preferences, and also note a good fit. Remember the ‘filtering people with astrology thread’? Its okay to do that with basic attraction as well.

    Along that line, after a very busy weekend, I intend to post a story to Elsa privately about my old Scorpio Moon friend that would probably make many readers extremely uncomfortable.

    On discomforting types: You know that astrotwin post? I had my own synchronous twinning yesterday. Picked up a new client who’s Angelia Jolie’s twin. ‘Controverisal, compelling, attractive and repellent’ are all apropriate words for Jolie. I sure am looking forward to meeting the new client.

    Re: Writing as a mode of attraction. A gift/art of writing can be voice, it can also be story, analysis, or sheer information depending on the genre. Some writers are very much like their written voice, others different.

    One friend who’s quite a skillful writer (and teacher of creative writing) enjoys, nay *prefers*, the quality of ‘wrath’ and ‘tearing somone an new one’ that appears in my critical writing. Some of my most entrtaining writing is tonally difficult with a certain ‘violence’. This is not my favorite voice, but it does make for some writing that’s been enjoyed and praised by people I admire. Art can be like like that. (I’ve mentioned Edvard Munch) The natal conditions of certain houses/planets in my chart support this quality and I’m fine with it, and *well* aware of it as well. As is Marly. You may enjoy knowing t Pluto is exactly on the cusp of my 3rd house.

    Hi Marly!

  11. PS Tosh.
    Google and go to the ‘definition link’ in upper right hand corner of the screen. I chose the *1st* definition. (via answers.com)

    PS Marly.
    I’ll be in touch soon. Busy weekend. Thanks for your interest.

  12. CC, as I said, I did Google and used the first line in the first definition that showed up. Must be that because I’m in Europe, it’s not the same Google.
    Will get back to you later, if Elsa doesn’t mind…my ‘bother’ was my Libra being nice.
    I like to write too and have a lot to say too.

  13. CC,
    You take pride in bothering people. Sad, must be your way of attracting attention or your thinking that it shows power.
    Probably, that is exactly what “bothered’ me; because I didn’t see it as power, I just saw someone showing off in a very uncharismatic way. Maybe my Pluto /Saturn conjunction close to my Leo ASC made me feel that way.

    You said: ‘Van Gogh pined over a prostitute but never painted her’…. Why must he have painted her? Couldn’t it have inspired him to paint something or someone else? Isn’t it a matter of expressing ones feelings or mental state and not just painting the person or object that one is pining over? Maybe it was materialized by the specific yellow he used or maybe by the force of his brushstrokes?

    As for architecture-yes it can be very gender biased …if you think of architecture solely as an ambition to be well known. That requires sacrificing any personal life, which then leaves out women because for them, family must come first. An absurd and archaic way of thinking.
    Architecture is much more than that, especially with today’s technology. It is a very wide technical field that can be a very creative and satisfying career for both genders. Even today, in my daughters generation of architects, women are the majority, as they were in my class.
    I am curious about the opportunity that you turned down. Don’t they have entrance exams in the States? Did you pass them and then changed your mind? Usually, failed architects become critiques, at least most that I know.
    But then, I don’t think this is being fair to Elsa…we are going off theme.
    Have a pleasant day.

  14. Van Gogh didn’t cut his ear off because of some bitch. He cut his ear off because he was crazy. She just happened to be his bitch at the time so she got the ear.

  15. Hi Tosh,
    You go from Libra polite to the heavy handed Leo zone pretty easily, don’t you?

    In addition to the ‘bother’ and ‘violence’ of my chart, there is supreme vulnerability and tenderness. This thread is about Pi/12/Ne isn’t it?

    I have to admit, when you said you had a lot to write, I was looking forward to some congenial discussion.

    So. In self defense. Saturn-Pluto can be defensive or put others on the defensive, especialy if Mars is involved. (I have an aspect myself)

    I don’t take pride in bothering people. I said *without shame*, not pride – “I bother people.” You don’t seem to take my words at face value, but have inserted your abstract interpretation of them. That’s your take, not my character.

    Unsettling bother is a fact of my life I have learned to accept, other people are frequently untolerant of such realities. Uranus of disruption is VERY strong in my chart, as is the Sun. With Sa-Pl rising in Leo, you might understand this experience a bit. In fact, I see pride as a vice and value equanimity far more. I have lots of Libra.

    So back to pride. Pride can be seen as exhibitionistic and self centered, and the major work produced by Van Gogh’s emotional/physical violence against himself was a *self portrait*. He was an Aries, and the Sun is strong there. Pining did not take him further into *union with another* (a frequent subject of pining), but further into himself. And as arachnid notes, his madness. (Gauguin’s recently published letters from this period are revealing, yet obscure in an interesting way) Of course, Van Gogh’s first aspiration was to be a minister, not a painter. He was deemed unfit and overzealous. The religious inspiration was plainy there as well, working through his Mo|Ju conjunction. There are many levels to any chart and time is always flowing over the chart as change.

    As far as architecture goes, it is very hard for an architect to get projects built. It is doubly hard for a woman in the profession. Its not about fame, its about equal opportunity to express talent fully. I was just speaking with a woman of your generation who was in a class at UCLA in the 70s when women were first getting opportunity. She trained at the Royal College of Art as an undergrad and reflected on wider opportunity in the design field. It was quite interesting to hear her take on the choice of profession after retirement. I am glad your daughters have followed successfully in your path. I am happy with the life I am living.

    Unfortunately this willingness to be myself has offended you and drawn your judgement. If you have further comments about astrology and art based in a mutual respect for difference, I am more than happy to hear from you again.

  16. Okay kiddies! Break it up! You’re all extremely intelligent, that much is obvious… Actually, don’t break it up. This hissy-fit over semantics and syntax is highly amusing! Continua! I have to prepare some munchies to eat while this develops. Also, Arachnid, can you refrain from using the ‘b’ word regarding women? It’s tacky and offensive.

  17. PS Tosh,
    Sorry to ignore your question in my first response.

    No, the USA doesn’t hold qualifying exams for beginning study in the profession. I was accepted after portfolio review and personal interviews at Cornell. It is currently ranked #1 for its 5 year undergraduate program.

    Why didn’t I go? Suffice it to say, while the lure of the Ivy League is strong, I was also accepted to other quality institutions. I had options, and limitations. To tell you an unflattering truth, architects have a reputation for insufferable arrogance and condescending manners, and my own weak points didn’t need more encouragement in that direction. High rates of alcoholism are also found in that profession, strangely, accountants too. I am glad for you that you are only addicted to the internet and so personable. You must be a remarkable practitioner.

    I know several architects who left the profession and went into product or graphic design. None of the art writers I have studied with or read regularly have training in architecture – but in art history and practice, philology, philosophy and literature. I did enjoy a course(History and Theory of Space) with a wonderful Persian scholar who moved from architecture to a doctorate in geography. Architecture is a profound practice, and not to be undertaken to feed the ego or impress people. It is the heart of all occult traditions, as is astrology. I agree, this is somewhat off topic. If you have further interest in discussing the world of arts and letters, perhaps it should be private. But I am interested in your astrological opinions, and others may be too.

    If you have anything astrological to say about Van Gogh, I’m interested. But, the original topic of concern was pining. I still find pining to be unhealthy, and wonder if you disagree. In the world of high art or the avant garde – health(mental, physical or emotional), is occasionally in short supply.

  18. CC – i very much enjoy the wisdom, tolerance and restraint in your comments. It’s uplifting, constructive and instructional to the human condition, which coincidently, is precisely the reason i return to this particular blog. Again, and again. i suppose i must admire your aptitude for transcendence, courtesy Pluto et al.

    i think we all look forward to hearing more about art & life from you, Dear CC, and doubt anyone will be lead astray involuntarily.

    BTW i find both sides of this banter are, well, strikingly familiar should one dig around a bit, ‘Why waste it?’ and ‘Why is it a waste?’ which amuses me no end! %^P
    …not unlike arachnid’s keen observation.

    peaceout~ ^_^

  19. While this has been very rich and with much depth –
    [I copied the Pi/Ne/12 stuff to remind me in the future of the difference between pining and longing, and I loved the “–for me, life is about experiencing feelings, emotions, whatever kind, and not just producing or doing something always with a purpose”] –
    it’s sad to see such an interesting discussion devolve to personal attacks.

  20. Hey CC,
    Yes sometimes, when a specific situation asks for it, I do tend to jump from Libra polite to heavy handed Leo. That’s me I guess, and learning Astrology has helped me understand it better.
    I cut short my writing because our comments were becoming too personal and I wanted to avoid any problems Elsa may have because of them.
    I have never looked at Van Gogh’s chart….I have no interest in discussing his astrological aspects.
    I am a novice in astrology, just started seriously reading about it a couple of months ago. I haven’t yet decided if I want to be a full fledged astrologer, but I see it is already helping me and I am eager to learn more. I find I pick up things much easier through a general conversation than by reading an astrology handbook and that is the reason I’m here at Elsa’s.

    But back to our discussion…. to where we started..
    Pining – since it was a new word for me, one I had never heard of or used before, I had to google and then went by the first results:

    From wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn –
    Noun

  21. Just for the record, I want to let CC know her manner of expressing herself does ~not~ push me away. Au contraire. She has been my favorite commentor here from the start and I always look forward to her comments on any of Elsa’s entries. Have learned much from them, whether I agree with them or not, the same as I always learn much from Elsa, whether in agreement or not. (To learn, one does not have to agree.)

    CC, if you write anywhere else online, I’d love to read more of you. Can you please let me know, via the email link on my website. Thanks.

  22. Good Morning all,
    Thanks to those of you who have been supportive of my writing.

    Tosh – I see no reason to ever be heavy handed (though I can be), when gentle and kind conserve energy and reduce the ripple effect of strong reactions/emotions. The latter is harder for me than the former.

    I do not find workers like “anyone that does anything that makes them responsible for other people’s well being” have a free pass to be arrogant and condescending. Since you may not be a native speaker of English, you may not be aware of highly negative connotations of these words, “arrogant, condescending.” They are considered quite rude — and depending on the circumstance — egocentric, mean spirited, motivated by a ‘chip on the shoulder’, evidence of a superiority complex, or seen as overcompensation for deep insecurity.

    Regardless, I am not a surgeon or architect – with good reasons.

    Regardless, I agree emotions are to be experienced fully. How we respond to emotions is a choice. Pining is often a response to loss or lack, and not one I encourage in myself or others. Pining is like a train of thought that comes from the inner critic. Someone who has a lot of negative self talk is probably less attached to perpetuating such painful experience than a piner, and no less free to simply _stop_. Psychologists and psychotherapists may use a form of cognitive behavior therapy to alter destructive mental patterns. It takes alternative action to come out of pining, because *stilling the mind* to percieve emotions apart from the residue of other past emotions is not easy. This is the goal of living in the present moment. Experiencing what ever arises in the present moment fully, and acting with freedom from the desire for a particular outcome. Happiness in all conditions. I will not elaborate my preferred philosophy of emotions or technique of meditative concentration here, but I have one(a form of mindfulness – observing the sensations on the body that arise with all emotions and mental phenomena).

    If you enjoy pining, go on ahead. I am probably not the type of astrologer you would consult. Thanks for you reply. I have no interest in continuing an architectural or semantic dialogue, or researching statistics to support my anecdotes about alcoholism and the professions.

    Lisa – I have written extensively under my own name (not the handle that appears here) in a number of online astrology groups in years past. I’ve left those groups because I attract responses of all shapes and forms which have regurlarly focused on matters I am not interested in discussing in astrological forums. This thread has some excellent examples of that sort of content. I enjoy Elsa’s space and writing, and it is a pleasure have someplace where I want to participate. I will eventually put up some sort of place to find me online, but do not blog or need a website right now.

    paiyeo – thanks so much for all the flattering adjectives you have selected in your writing. It warms my heart to find others responding to the qualities I have begun to develop through persistent effort. Astrology comes very easily – tolerance and restraint do not. They come from having a disciplined mind and open heart – which I try to concentrate on love, peace and equanimity through all experiences. It does take work, but I make time and have an inclination. It is an art of living, and you are attuned to my aesthetic.

    Thanks again to all. I am still quite occupied, but have enjoyed the results of this thread.

  23. CC, I agree, enough with this subject. Apparently we are misreading and misinterpreting each other.
    I didn’t say I like being heavy handed. I said astrology has helped me understand myself and why I sometimes react like that.
    I never said that I like to pine or that I am the type of person that does pine. Please, don’t read text I have not written.
    And yes, I am not a native speaker of the English language but even so, the meaning of arrogance has the same (negative) connotation in almost all languages. I used it fully aware of its meaning. Nowhere did I say it is a positive trait only that it seems to be common among those professions and yes, no matter how negative it is, I stand by my opinion that sometimes it is needed to push a project through.

    Have a great day.

  24. “I didn’t say I like being heavy handed.”

    Hi Tosh,
    Who did?

    I didn’t comment on what you like, what makes you feel powerful, what you take pride in, how charismatic you are, how you attract attention to yourself, or whether you I think you are sad.

    You have commented on all of these things with regard to me.

    Bye.

  25. You did CC.
    Your implications are very clear. Don’t underestimate me or the other readers.
    Of all the things you listed that I have commented about you, only your not being charismatic is my own comment, the rest are derived from your own texts.

  26. Astounding! I just finished reading this blog about pining and am in awe with the incredible intelligence of my gender. You all do us an honor by engaging in such heated debate!

    Now, on pining. I am the quintessential “piner”. As I mentioned in a recent blog I have a Scorpio Venus, Neptune, Moon conjunction……I am designed this way for a purpose and the design is without flaw.

    I remember reading Linda Goodman’s Love Signs many years ago and I distinctly remember her writing that she did not care for Taureans. I was totally offended by this ignorant comment even though I have no Taurean planets in my chart. What offended me was the fact that a person could disdain another for something that was totally out of their control.

    There is no mistake in the design of our beings and if one is designed to have an affinity in the longing for the unattainable then it is as it should be. We should appreciate all facets of human design and accept that what is different about another is truly a complement to our living experience.

    Leo, Scorpio, Pisces, Virgo, Gemini, Sagittarius, Libra, Aries, Aquarius, Capricorn, Cancer, and Taurus ALL have their strengths and weaknesses…..none better or worse than the other. Throw in the aspects and you have a plethora of possibilities in these signs divining the intent of their souls. How incredibly beautiful…..how poetic!

  27. Well said Jamie. Though I have to admit – avid people-watcher that I am – I’ve rather enjoyed my first experience of an ‘Elsa forum clash’!

    Some interesting points amongst all the noise and fury. CC wrote, and I think this is the nub of it:
    ” It takes alternative action to come out of pining, because *stilling the mind* to percieve emotions apart from the residue of other past emotions is not easy. ”

    I’ve looked in my own chart/s to see whether pining is indicated, and it’s not (to my very inexperienced eye) although I’d put myself down as a terrible piner. In my experience, pushing longings away merely displaces them, it doesn’t make them ‘go away’. Only time and distance does that, and if it’s your nature to pine then you just have to work through it somehow.

    Like Tosh, and as a writer endlessly curious about the human condition, I don’t find it particularly productive to stifle emotion, even negative emotion. That does have a cost however.

    I’d love to comment on CC’s and Tosh’s clashes but I’d better not! I can easily see how some would find CC’s mode of address off-putting – I don’t, and that’s partly because I use the ‘statement from experience’ type of exposition myself in discourse (and I’ve noticed that mine has been the final word on several threads here, for whatever reason…).

    This all relates to to Elsa’s post yesterday about ‘disturbing’ people, which I’ve continued to think about. Among other types, I’ve noticed that people whose self-confidence is nakedly expressed do attract antagonism, whether the confidence is perceived to be warranted or not. It maybe because they (we?) give off a vibe which precludes receptiveness to other people in some fundamental way.

  28. PS I’ve just noticed the comments on this whole thread date from 2006! – But Elsa posted the original comment again today on the blog – I’m puzzled! – though that explains why I don’t recognise many of the names posting!!

  29. Unnecessary drama aside… I like what Nina said.

    “”This is going to be controversial, but I am going to say it anyway. No matter how powerful and real your feelings may be for someone, if that person cannot fully and honestly return them and therefore actively love you back, these feelings mean nothing. Sure, they may feel powerful, deep, mythic in scope and proportion. You may “never ever have felt this way before.” But who cares? If the person you “love” cannot freely spend his days thinking about you and being with you, it’s not real love.””

    Though, this one also isn’t perfect or entirely emotionally healthy… But, it’s true. If it isn’t reciprocrated it serves no pupose, for the purpose of love is to keep people of partnerships loyal. If you are loving someone who doesn’t love you, obviously the system we evolved to benefit us had itself a glitch.

  30. Dude, seriously… that person is a shark.

    & the winds have dropped & the sun came up & they all sailed along in harmony again, happily ever after =)

  31. I pulled this up from 2006 because I am doing something today.

    arachnid = the AMF 😉 He liked to stir the pot.

    CC and Tosh blew up on another thread(s). CC was an astrologer, writing on lists 15 years ago (as was I). She used to hang around salon’s Table Talk as I recall. Don’t know much about Tosh. CC still checks in from time to time (I think). Tosh, I have no idea.

    Scott is the same Scott I write about now and then and Lise is still here (comes and goes and is currently here) but under a different name.

    paiyeo – don’t know if she is around or not but I always liked her.

    Not sure which Heather that is, but also think she is still here with a new name. If she has left it’s been recently – sometimes people just stop commenting but still read and that’s what I think is the deal with Heather.

    Marly got mad when I confronted her for claiming she wrote MY MOTHER’S words. Apparently it was my fault she stole someone’s line she read a week prior, wrote it on the blog where she read it as if she thought of it and this makes me a bitch. 🙂

    Nina is still around.

    I think Don is gone but can probably be found on Maurice’s site – maybe.

    I don’t recall who T. is.

    jamie is a different jamie than the jamie we have now. She is another one I like a lot and she probably stops by from time to time.

    She’s an astro-twin of one of the best friends I have ever had, so that was interesting. 🙂

  32. Elsa I agree with you in your article above.. Relationship is a two way street and some people and me forget that it is.

  33. ”This is going to be controversial, but I am going to say it anyway. No matter how powerful and real your feelings may be for someone, if that person cannot fully and honestly return them and therefore actively love you back, these feelings mean nothing. Sure, they may feel powerful, deep, mythic in scope and proportion. You may “never ever have felt this way before.” But who cares? If the person you “love” cannot freely spend his days thinking about you and being with you, it’s not real love.” quote found by Nina

    I really love this statement but I might add that I also feel love for people I don’t know… this type of love that I’m talking about his not personal but I find it still valuable. Personal love is what I would compare to real love. I won’t particularly love someone who did me wrong but I generally have love for everybody and anyone…
    I will take a spider outside my house instead of killing it for example, I will save bugs 😉
    Real love is the type of love that I will want in any relationship but you can still love without attachment I believe.
    I have a pisces venus square neptune so I definitely relate to the illusion or delusion so reality is what I focus on in relationships.

  34. “Van Gogh didn’t cut his ear off because of some bitch. He cut his ear off because he was crazy. She just happened to Be his bitch at the time so she got the ear.”

    Haha! Hilarious:) Some easy on the heavy is always good.

  35. No question. Unrequited love sucks. But some of the bigger questions are: How did I end up in this situation again? Why didn’t I pay attention to those red flags and follow my intuition from day one? How does this encounter make me right about my beliefs about myself? What is the underlying belief I have about myself that would allow me to get into this painful state?….

  36. Oh, I didn’t notice the time stamps on the comments! Are any of these advice articles new? I was hoping that people had started writing back in again…

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