I found myself in a tangle today and it happened fast, like in a split second. I was thinking of how difficult it is to be around negative people. They say when you’re old you best think of something to talk about besides your aches and pains or no one is going to want to be around you and I suppose this is true. But then I thought of another scenario.
What if you have a friend who is pie in the sky to the point of delusion. A manic-flavored situation, I’m talking about. The kind of person where there is always a new scheme or a new man or a new idea that is going to revolutionize their life which is on life-support. Is there a duty to say something? Or do you slap them on the back and wish them well on their way over the cliff?
I am not keen to rain on a person’s parade but also feel responsible to introduce reality at times. Anyone else struggle with this? Where do you draw your line?
I don’t think there is a duty to give people a reality check. I simply limit my time listening. It’s win-win in my book. They’re free to bung up their life and I’m free to not listen.
However…I do listen to my SO give his Mum reality checks all the time and it is hilarious:
“So are you planning on still spending lots of money you don’t have on manicures and toxic cosmetics now that you’re claiming you’re totally broke?”
Or
“Wow, you love that gold ring too much to sell, eh? Which of your 5 husbands gave it to you?”
His Mum (stellium in Leo) doesn’t listen anyway, she just cries…”AWWW…gimme a break!” (Before giggling and saying she can’t remember which husband…)
Guess I’m saying: sometimes you just shouldn’t waste your breath. Some people only like the sound of their own voice…if it’s not you who’s listening, it will be someone else.
Wow, cynical much kashmiri? LOL
I struggle with this. I usually pat them on the back and watch them fall over the cliff. If they ask specifically what I think I am completely honest. Occasionally I give them a sort of philosophical and detached Jupiter/ Aqua sounding observation. Sometimes they get it, and sometimes they miss it completely.
I guess I reach out when I feel like it. But damn, I don’t have the energy to be up in everyone elses business like that all the time.
This is a HUGE struggle for me. It’s what I am going to see a therapist about. I’m tired of being beaten up for trying to help. I don’t meddle. People tell me the most ridiculous things, knowing I’m going to tell them it’s ridiculous. Then they lash out at me.
My trouble is, I feel like I must keep every relationship completely superficial in order to function and avoid being hurt. Superficial relationships feel completely useless to me; hence, I feel like I have no real friends.
So, I’ve spent the last couple months watching people I care about jumping off cliffs and exclaiming, “oh wow, you jumped off. I so didn’t see that coming”.
“The kind of person where there is always a new scheme or a new man or a new idea that is going to revolutionize their life which is on life-support. Is there a duty to say something?”
You mean like Rielle Hunter? Fortunately, I don’t allow people like that into my sphere anymore because they’re just too crazymaking and I don’t have time for it. But you know, like in Rielle’s case, they land on their feet. She’s in a multimillion $ home and I’m SURE she has a book deal coming up. I’m sure she had her share of friends telling her to get grounded to no avail. Now she’s famous (or notorious) and rich, both of which she always wanted, and we sensible and non-homewrecking people are still here plugging away at being responsible. Go figure.
Nah, I don’t think its helpful to speak out, because it doesn’t make any difference. If they’re gonna jump they’re gonna.
Oh, I should mention…I have Mercury square Saturn. I became more open about how I felt about things in general after my Saturn Return.
I struggled with this until I was 30…not fun or easy. It’s a hard thing to do, but you just can’t be people’s reality check. You can’t…I guess with my Merc/Saturn I view it now as a control issue.
And saying all this…I’m still the person people go to when they fall off the cliff, so I’m not sure if I’ve *resolved* all this~ I just feel more comfortable about detaching when it’s happening.
I don’t worry about it, maybe a gentle reality check, as in “Really? Oh, Oh, well cool”
Detachment is great and necessary, another Mercury Saturn person says.
Hmm… I used to be that person.
I also used to step in.
Now, I just say nothing. And I used to confuse that with being cruel, but see it’s the only way. I have a rule “don’t give advice unless asked” and it’s pretty much applied to all situations and it’s made a huge difference in my life.
What could you possible say anyway? There’s no pie in that sky, missy. And then they turn around and like Rainie said, lash out at you.
Nah, better to say nothing.
I never try to save people from themselves. Sometimes they just need to learn something the hard way. I used to give advice which was unwanted and, as you say, people lashed out at me saying “Who do you think you are?” Besides, I also happened to be the one who was being saved from herself and I decided I’d better spare such experiences to others.
Really, it’s hard enough to help people who ask. In fact I’ve known of a few people who ask even though (it shows up later) they already know what they are going to do, and even some people who ask just so they can react and do the opposite.
fuck all that. My own life is more than enough to try to keep up with.
LOL invisible 79, I also gave up trying to wear a watch. On me the attempt is just ridiculous and exasperating.
I say leave them alone. They are the ones that are going to pay the bill for their actions. Let them be the one making the decision. Plus what is the real reality anyway?
So, I have a friend who spends months in manic episodes. There’s no talking him down. Even if you say something like, “Have you thought about the expense involved in this, that, and the other critical aspect of your fifteenth ‘most awesome home-employment job EVAR’ this month, and is there a market for it around here?”, you’re just completely blown off. There is no limiting the delusion, you just have to nod and ride with it until you can change the subject. (Which, with a manic person, will be a half-hour or so later.)
Not that I tried very hard in that first place, my philosophy has been to let people try whatever they wish, but knowing this guy has made me stop even questioning. =/
You can’t be responsible for other’s choices. You can’t, you can’t, you can’t. You’ll drive yourself nuts trying. In my book, it’s more important (and healthier) to be ready with the Band-Aids.
I suppose this is a Saturn function? I’ve got Saturn conjunct Sun and Merc, trine Neptune.
when and if the friend is doing something that affects me, or my friendship to them. Thats when I say something. Well a part from the odd comment here and there that I know the person may digest for thought while they moving onto “the next thing”. Depends if there is any digestion of thoughts or self reflection for that person. I probably would not be friends with them otherwise. A client is another story.
kingsley
i do, but i’m pretty cautious about it. i tend to feel things out a little to see if they’re interested in listening, and if not, i don’t bother.
I am the reality check. I’m the friend all my friends call when someone needs their head gently but firmly pulled out of their ass ….
The line is I do my best not to meddle, not to make judgment calls (I’m really good at “what happens if I do x versus y”), and to focus on information and possibilities, not ass kicking.
Would never rain on anyone’s parade. Voluntarily, that is.
But if they asked, I don’t think I could pretend I didn’t see the flaws/problems. I’d be diplomatic though.
The only people I give unsolicited advice to are my grown children. Whether they listen or not – sometimes it’s hard to tell.
Otherwise I don’t say too much unless someone asks for my opinion or advice, and even then things get dicey because sometimes folks are only asking because they hope you’ll tell them what they want to hear.
But I’ve also been on the receiving end of reality checks/warnings and hardly ever paid attention to them, just frowned at the one speaking to me in a puzzled way while I was floating backwards over the cliff – smile.
I have had some friends like this. The friendships always tended to end, though. Not because of the pie in the sky, but because it never seems to stop there. I am happy to listen to someone’s plans, and give my gentle honest opinion (while still respecting their right to live their life their way). However, I am not going to bail them out, financially or emotionally (by spending hours and hours comforting them). If the friendship can survive on these terms, I am totally fine with it. Usually, it can’t. No harm, just not compatible.
On the flip side, I have had people try to “talk me down” from new things I wanted to do (and had seriously reasoned out) and it was really deflating. Not to mention they were wrong 🙂
Because of that experience, I usually ask myself if I really respect this person. If I don’t so much, then I wouldn’t say anything. And also reevaluate the friendship probably. But that’s another story.
Llama, I hear you. I’ve had people try and “talk me down” too…and I still remember my SO telling his GP he was going to be a yoga teacher. Her exact words were “You can’t do that!”
Being the Capricorn he is he demanded to know why she said that and why she thought that, and she sheepishly answered
“Er, I don’t know…I don’t know why I said that. I just wanted to save you the pain if it couldn’t happen.”
He was dealing with the recovery of a serious accident at the time. In case anyone asks, yes he is a yoga teacher now!
Been there, done that. I am a Mercury trine Saturn person and am pretty well grounded in realism/pessimism, depending on how you look at it. And I attracted extremely optimistic boyfriends back in the day.
One of them was in la la la denial about pretty much everything. He’d EXPECT to get a loan from a certain relative even after everyone warned him that said relative was really really tired of loaning money that no relatives ever paid back. He wanted to get back together with me and floated me all kinds of stuff that sounded good, and I’m sure he believed it at the time…but hall of mirrors, it wasn’t real. He just talked himself into thinking nothing but good times were ahead.
Another ex once told me some joke about a girl who wanted to turn into a horse, and then told me he TRULY thought said child could turn into a horse. I said, “How?” and the answer boiled down to, “Well, first a scientific breakthrough of miraculous proportions could happen…” He later dumped me and said chances of us getting back together were “microscopically infinitesimal.” Guy always had to leave some impossible loophole.
I can only assume it’s some kind of warped universe balancing that I ended up with these guys. My mom was an optimist and my dad was a pessimist and here I am in the middle of it.
Really, some people are going to do the stupid thing no matter what you say. They are too busy sticking their fingers in their ears and singing to listen to you anyway. I guess it’s the only way they can survive reality- is to ignore it.
I used to try to keep family and friends from running to the edge and jumping off the cliff. However I stopped doing that as I usually got into horrendous arguments and blamed when that friend or family members hair brained idea didn’t work. All because I tried to prevent disaster.
Now days I just watch as they jump off the cliff as I shake my head and then after they hit the ground I sweep up the pieces put them back together and patch them up as best as possible and tell them I love and care about them send them on their way hopefully they are wiser than the time before. I don’t get blamed we are still friends and I never have to say I told you so.