I’ve said this on these boards before. I think that we really will be learning to do more with less. And those of us who don’t will be less effective. Pluto in Sagittarius has been hard for people to recover from. That bigger is better and more is even better.

I also think that we will be dealing with our definition of authority (Pluto in Capricorn). We are already dealing with our collective authority figures falling from grace in a huge way. IE Jerry Sandusky…

I’m hoping that on the positive side of these trends, we will have more empowering authority over our individual selves as we see our shadow in wanting to control others. I also hope that a quality over quantity mindset infects our culture. Quality made goods, service and food. Our current ways are unsustainable as they use too many resources. The quicker we learn and work at something more efficient, the better.

I am thinking about the whole idea of collapsed foundations with regard to all of this. The civil liberties issue, for example, has long degenerated into “I want what I want when I want it” instead of the nation guarding liberties for all. Greed has gone unchecked by many, at the expense of the whole. I may be wrong about this, but I thought the foundation of the country was once about hard work, consideration for your community, etc. I don’t think we’ve maintained the foundation, and I wonder if it’s too late to fix it.

I’m really interested in this but apart from being very concerned about it, I know nothing about what to expect. What others said above sounds right, worldwide though – not just in USA. Hard times. No free passes or free rides. Like the Great Depression maybe? And then I think of the rise of the Nazi movement and world wars. I hope it doesn’t get that bad but I just don’t know. Feels like the worst of the worst can and might happen.

caribou- Then Great Depression and the Nazi movement was more of a Saturn square Pluto deal,I think.

The two-party polarization means that you have to throw your vote to somebody who says a few things you agree with but perhaps has strong positions that you think are terrible. That is very strange. It’s like we now have to buy into things all the way or we can’t belong.

Maybe people will just say no to having to lie to themselves or pretend to buy in when they really don’t. That would certainly shake things up. The word unsustainable fits. The election process is ridiculous. The degree to which we have to talk the party line just to keep a job is ridiculous. People are naturally afraid of chaos and fear often makes people more prone to domination.

I have mixed feelings about how rough or smooth the transition might be, but obviously the times they are a’changing. The Occupy movement has been a game changer just because it gave people a taste of what it looks like for people who are change agents to function together without giving up their own ideas and autonomy. IOW they didn’t have to pledge allegiance to the Reich, or to anybody at all.

Sorry about the spelling – it is Debt..

THE GREAT T-SQUARE says there is a third side

for me I simply see “twin towers” a warning of global collapse, 1st one, like the first financial collapse, destabilised the global structure/building, people getting in there to save what they can including entering the 2nd building or structure that seems to be unaffected, then the second hit which I feel is about to come and yes globally, which will bring the whole lot down and everything around it.

Sounds like doom and gloom eh? but to me, why try to renovate a structure that is beyond repair just because we dont want that one to go as disheveled as it may be, sometimes its better and only logical to demolish and start again.

Yes I do believe we will all either get used to less, and those who have lived in poverty and know how to survive will become valuable teachers, or suffer and succomb to it. Greed has been out of control for a long long time, most people dont even realise they are being greedy as it is taught and therefore known and acceptable societal belief. Sad but true, when folk wont give up their luxuries for others who dont have there needs, for whatever reason, greed prevails, to me and even if i only had only 2 loaves of bread to eat but my family only needed 1 that day and my neighbour had none, well it would be my pleasure to share. Nope Im not a martyr, just a realist and an idealist married all together, once apon a time, that was what community was about, till it died….

But yeah just my view through my rose coloured glasses which i wear half way down my nose so i am able to keep a clear view of reality too

@Josi–the wise ones.

There has been a huge and determined push from those in power in recent years – political and economic power – to consolidate what they have and to draw ever more to themselves.

This can be seen in every area of the global scenario: the EU, the UN, the push for supra-national ‘World Government’ using NGOs as a vehicle, a corrupt supra-national banking system that enables the powerful to move money on a whim beyond the power of laws – think George Soros and his ilk, the monstrous agglomeration of power over the world food sources and supply by unaccountable entities such as Dow and Monsanto, the international attempt to divert capital from the West using the AGW scam… you can complete your own list.

The coming battle if there is to be one will be between this galloping centralisation of resources and power over them, and the people, if they can be persuaded to fight it. Sadly, in most countries the education system and a supine media are doing their best to ensure the people don’t notice what’s happening.

“The teachers don’t even know who they are anymore.”

How disturbing.