“As a side note, a study found that people with more feminine characteristics (physically or otherwise) are generally more attractive to other people.”

Well that fits because Mars is not supposed to be pretty or attractive. It’s a completely different function.

Funny that I typed “just ended” I’ve been divorced over a year and separted for nearly two…hmmm. Time flies…

Loonsounds- I like this:

funny comnment, soft bed turn you into a girl. how could any couple ever fight when one of them is always so damn funny?

And I like this topic. I think women are trained to be this way, at least in the US. ALthough I can’t speak for the generation older than me (I’m 28), I remember a lot of my friends in relationships turning into housewives when previously they had not given the impression they would. Those who got married disappeared behind the doors of their houses and talked exclusively about baking and babies and their husbands while doing laundry. Of course, there were my other girlfriends who couldn’t get tied down in that way, but longed for it as in ‘the grass is always greener.’

This is only a sample of the people I know, and exceptions to this seemed to have a different definition of love altogether. But who knows? They might fall into the same pattern. I did for a while too. And then I got upset with my boyfriend for not being manly enough. Haha!

Oh God, loonsounds, I would never have survived the whole biscuit/food tray thing.

One thing I will say is, I love to please, and I always feel rich inside when (in my case, whoever the SO is at the moment!) picks up on the ways, small and big, that I do this. I know from experience the reverse is true too. But there’s something even more beautiful to me, and much rarer, and that’s when you’re with someone who picks up on the ways, big and small, that you’re just a pleasure to be with. Does that make sense?

Anyway, it takes a good dose of self-awareness for me not to turn my SO into daddy, and not to allow the SO to turn me into mommy.

One time, I fell real hard for a fella, a real manly man at that, but on just the third date, after a roll in a very soft bed (!) he suddenly left the bedroom, came back with a photo album, and proceeded to show me all these photos of him and his family and friends from birth through high school. I mean, this is a man who had a daughter, and I hadn’t even seen a picture of her yet, and there I was sittin’ naked, listening to his narrative and lookin’ at the “here I am in kindergarten” photos, and I literally could feel the air being sucked out of my body, and I bolted out of there as soon as he was done. It’s only after my consultation with Elsa that I understood the physical sensation I felt at that time was my very sensitive “Oh my God, this hunk of a man wants to turn me into his mommy” radar.

I think I have the other extreme. My partner has Pluto in his 4th House and I couldn’t mother him even if I wanted to. (Er, I don’t want to, but you get the drift). He also has Scorpio Moon conjunct Venus.
His own mother basically sold him down the river after the death of his brother and he’s been extremely independent ever since. He is definitely a man who loves women, and the “mother” relationship comes up in other ways. For example all his doctor, who he has been seeing for 30 years, is a woman. And they are close. Now he is deep into yoga therapy training and a large percentage of his fellow students, mentor, instructors etc. are women. He is very comfortable being soothed and comforted by them, whether through discussion about what they’re learning or what he is experiencing. But he has trouble asking me for anything. That fear of rejection is always there it seems.

I have a manly man and he does his thing and I do my thing and at times we come together and do “our” thing. I really like to “do” for other people especially my family. Maybe this is venus in cancer, hmmm… not sure. Sometimes I am a bit harsher about feelings then him, he has a cancer moon and I have an aquarius moon soo…. ya know.

I want my man to be a man and maybe on occasion help me out with stuff “manly” stuff,lol.

I don’t like manly men. They tend to be a lot angrier, a lot more into watching sports, a lot less sympathetic to anything I’m interested in, and they tend to come with attitude about “me Tarzan, you woman who cook clean for me.” (Exhibit A: my friend’s husband. I swear he got married just for the cooking and the cleaning so he wouldn’t have to.) Yes, I’d like a “feminized” man, thank you, because I’ll have a lot more in common with him and we can actually have something to say outside the bedroom. And maybe he won’t expect me to do everything in the house.

But I’m the “man” here, really.

My man has actually been reading about men having less testosterone due to plastics, petrolium and other polutants than ever before. And then I saw a documentary on the birthrates of boys being much lower than ever before due to petrolium. The study that the doc was based on was of a small community living near a plastics plant.

So it may not be the women doing it.. but rather a general lowering of testosterone due to the increase in plastics in the last 40 years.

L and Sa Diablo… I was going to say the same thing. I wonder if women with strong Aquarius in their charts (Like me – I have an Aquarius Moon and Mars in the 4th house) tend to prefer men who have more androgynous rather than manly-man qualities? Looking back, most of my men have been quite “feminine”. They love animals, they love to cook, they’re not heavily into beer and sport, they put a lot of care into their appearance, that sort of thing…. I find men like these more attractive then macho types… who are also attractive in some ways but then we end up fighting way too much and disagree with everything. I guess I’m not much of a fighter.

I agree with what Liz said about the plastics and petro-chemicals with high xenoestrogen levels. That’s exactly why the men are turning femme. It’s also why so many gays are surfacing.

Women don’t want to feminize men, they want to control a masculine man. Yes, the culture is more urban, decadent, optimized for transexual this, and metrosexual that, but these are all latter day attempts to do away with powerful masculine forces.
Don’t ask your upwardly mobile feminine readership. Ask normal, middle class, family oriented women. Its the Battle of Sexes. But that takes the presence of Mars. Read my article: “Women are from Saturn, Men are from Uranus” http://www.hubpages.com/hub/Christofer's Flow

Set up the premise the way you do, and you will get the responses you do. I can tell you what men hate, omnipresent female suggestion about issues that are not on his mind as being important, or even worthy of his time. They used to call that “nagging”, but that’s anachronistic. And what is not cool these days is to use anachronistic phrases. Forgive my use of the word “cool”. The big 30,000 foot view of astrology is that all these forces must work together in the great scheme of things. Any discussion about destroying masculinity is below the 30,000 foot level and is necessarily fuel for women’s discussions about what is “in” and “current”. This women invented, and thank God for it. Otherwise, all we would have is men sitting around passing gas, and smiling proudly.

i am male at the moment but class myself as pre-op transsexual