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Astrology And Deprivation - It Has It’s Upside: Making a Case For Saturn / Capricorn
Astrology In Real Life…
I have a friend who is involved or rather she is associated with a man who finds women everywhere he goes. He finds mother substitutes, specifically and it’s just uncanny. He finds these women (or they find him) and they pretty much form a line waiting to meet this man’s needs.
There is nothing you can do about something like this outside of observe it and people do. The women don’t compete. Instead they remark to each other… “Look at how many mothers he has…” This man is in his 40’s and in whatever case I told her this story…
When my daughter was a baby, about 3 years old she used to like to ride on those mechanical grocery store ponies. Around here, they cost a penny which I think it pretty cool. One cent and you can actually buy something worth having.
So one day, after paying for my groceries we headed over to the pony per our ritual and found the pony occupied. There was a little boy on the pony… dark haired, grinning and seriously over-fed. You know. This was a well-loved kid if you know what I mean. A lot of people do this with their first baby. They spoil them. And this boy in particular was from a culture where boys are revered girls not so much.
So anyway, this kid was on the pony and he was happy. His mother was clapping for him enthusiastically to say the least. They made quite a pair these two, and then the pony stopped. Uh oh!
The kid started screaming his head off. The mother looked at me and I kept a blank face because it’s none of my business. She shrugged and put another penny in the pony, making a point to focus on this little boy… her little prince, clapping and cooing and so forth. It’s in her body language, see. She turned slightly so my daughter and I were obliterated from her reality.
Never mind my daughter and I are waiting… maybe our ice cream is melting in the grocery bags I was holding, we were going to stand there and wait while these two had their… thing.
So the pony galloped and galloped and galloped and mother cooed and cooed and cooed and the boy grinned and beamed and grinned and then the pony stopped.
No crying this time. He had his mother trained or so it seemed. Because all this kid had to do is look at her expectantly and next thing you know, she had another penny and she was putting it in the pony and I just couldn’t believe it.
“This is ridiculous,” I said to my daughter. “Something is wrong here. These people are never going to get off this pony. Sorry, babe but let’s get out of here. You’ll have to ride next time…”
The mother acted like she was so involved with her son she couldn’t hear me even though I was standing 3 feet from her. She didn’t so much as look over her shoulder. And my daughter is a sophisticated little chick, don’t think she’s not. I actually think she could glean the situation but aut anyway, here is my point:
Little boys with mothers like that, grow up and become like this man my friend knows. They are so profoundly crippled because the pennies just keep coming. And this is what I mean, every blessing is a curse in exact proportion (and vice versa).
Because as far as I am concerned this man and that little boy on the pony are the same person. The 40 year old boy does nothing but wait for various women to deliver whatever he needs… with bells on. And when one goes away there are 3more waiting. Actually, there are 10 more waiting and this kind of ease is invariably shown and promised in a natal chart.
I guess this is why they say Saturn / Capricorn / difficulty builds character. Because if every time you put your hand out, someone fills it for you without a second of delay, you wind up something akin to an amoeba. You just don’t form or become an adult.
Do you know any adults whose development is completely arrested like this? And how would you have handled the pony ride situation?
23 Responses to “Astrology And Deprivation - It Has It’s Upside: Making a Case For Saturn / Capricorn”
I know of them, but I refuse to know them personally.
I neither want to take care of someone that completely nor be taken of myself in this manner.
The whole situation baffles me, honestly - the guy who lets everyone do for him, the women that offer, the other people in his life that put up with this dysfunctional crap*. I cwouldn’t do it.
I have Saturn in 3rd house Virgo, no Capricorn at all.
What would someone’s chart who acted like this look like (either the coddler or the coddlee)? I’m not well-versed enough to even attempt to figure this one out. . .
*(Well, I think it’s dysfunctional, anyway. It’s not like I’m a professional here, I just work for one. :))
I would like to think that I would have asked them to let us have our turn. But probably not. I suspect I would have made some snide pissy comment and walked away. Maybe who I’ve been and who I’m becoming are crossing over in this analysis… answer…
I do know adults like that man. Both male and female. I don’t deal well with either sex of that behavior pattern. I tend to walk away. I expect others to be as self-sufficient as I am. Huge expectation, huh!
I had a coworker like that not long ago. He was very young (we were his first job after grad school) and the behavior of expecting all his needs and wishes to be provided for was very obvious. He was the only person I’ve seen get fired at my current workplace.
I’d probably have handled the pony situation just as you did, especially if I had a daughter as perceptive as Mosta.
Thank you for this, Elsa. I’ve just spent three weeks grumbling about all this Saturn in my chart–why does everything have to be such a *&@’ng slog?
The funny thing is that I just read this column right now and I was thinking along these lines this morning so it’s as if I was anticipating reading this today (I don’t have any internet at home).
I have two female friends who were coddled. They are both in their 30s. And they’re who I was thinking about this morning in the shower bc one of the things that these women have taught me is that their parents crippled them with attention. Their parents did everything for them. Both expect others to step in and take care of them at a moment’s notice. Unfortunately, Woman #1’s parents died and she was left completely helpless! She went from having her father balance her checkbook to having to figure out her deceased father’s extremely complicated financial situation, paying taxes on several homes, tracking several investments, etc. And it was a nightmare, too, bc it involved her brothers as well. She was a patsy for anyone who wanted to con her. It was the financial equivalent of going from riding a tricycle to being told that tomorrow you have to compete in the Tour de France! It was harrowing and overwhelming and, worst, she really wasn’t prepared. She had no one to turn to after a lifetime of having everything done for her. And it made me very thankful that I’ll never inherit any money from anyone. At one point she complained that no one had told her how she was supposed to do something (I can’t remember what it was specifically but it was something pretty simple) and she said: People are supposed to tell me how to do these things! I said: I guess, I never had anyone tell me. She said: Doesn’t that make you angry? And I could honestly answer: No, because I never had that expectation. I was all alone and I had to figure it out myself so it never occurred to me that others were supposed to step in. No one ever did so how could I be angry?
And the irony is that both women were so sheltered that they’re very fearful. They’re terrified!
In the case of that mechanical horse, I totally would’ve said something. That kind of selfishness makes me burn, man.
Btw, both women are very sweet but I had to suspend my friendship with Woman #1 when her diva behavior extended to trying to run my love life.
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I don’t think I was ever deprived, but I always had a difficult time thinking I was worthy of anything - my sun is square Saturn, which is in my 4th house, and I always felt like I had to work hard for everything. It has made me, as an adult, a person who has few expectations. I don’t see this as a bad thing, though, because I really appreciate the good things that happen to me more because I don’t expect them. The wonderful things that do happen come as a complete surprise to me - and I have many wonderful people in my life that I do not take for granted because of this. And I find that not having a sense of entitlement has made me more flexible and giving than I think I would have been had I been as “spoiled” as most first children are.
Wow. Thanks for this one, Elsa. It helps me reframe a relationship I had with a mom-magnet/man-child. I keep thinking he’s leading a charmed life.
Yes, and Saturn is in poor shape in the man’s chart, it is detrimented and in the 12th house, and Saturn in conjunct the Moon in the 12th house, meaning that the Moon is also afflicted (forgive me if this is not standard astro-lingo, but it is my bias that it hurts the moon to be closely hooked up with Saturn), and the Moon is also in mutual exchange with Mars, which is another harsh aspect on his moon.
This leads me to think that the people who grow up with all of these people (mothers) waiting to serve them, that their real life mother was actually had weak/poor/troubled/disfunctional/ perhaps even borderline personality disorder herself.
With this very weak saturn in this man, I have linked it all along, to his seeming inability to take any kind of responsibility for himself or to set any kind of safe limits, to make any kind of healthy boundaries.
And see, y’all, I have met the actual mother, and she is still, to this day, just like the mother with the rocking horse and the baby. She never did him any favors and there is the issue of too much child in the parent. I have not even looked at her chart, but I bet she has a weak Saturn also.
Through observing this man I have learned so much about the importance of a strong Saturn in a chart. It is almost as if that without some strength from Saturn, none of the potential good stuff in a chart is going to manifest.
This pony thing is actually a hidden matriarchy, because by not allowing their sons to grow up, moms keep the (emotional) power over them for ever. And by revering them at the same time, there is no escape. It’s a pretty good deal for a few pennies.
Conny-agreed. I’m glad this post resurfaced when it did. One of my siblings is a perpetual child (actually, 2 are. And they both have Cancer South Nodes).
It’s hard not to feel ignored on some level. No one ever needs to worry about me–I’m just not the type, plus I do well with what I’m given. But it’s hard (albeit fascinating on some level) when everyone around you is struggling and one giant baby is draining everyone of resources that would benefit most from being shared.
Conny - that is a great point. That mother made it very clear there was no one in the world but her and her son. Yecch.
oh, dear. i recently got out of a relationship with one of those. no wonder it fizzled so bad. i don’t coddle people and i pretty much ignored his attempts to convince me to. past a point. past the point where there seemed to be energy moving both directions.
easier to name the thing in hindsight.
Kashmiri–nicely put! I have a Peter Pan sibling (Cancer) who does the same thing…a vortex of attention always forms around him. (The guy I referred to in my post above was born a couple weeks after my brother…similar charts, similar personality.) And now that my brother has kids, the vortex forms around them, with him in the center. Funny how when people really demand attention they get it.
I have saturn in cap/4th house.. and it squares my venus to boot. have always felt like I had to work hard for everything I’ve gotten, but I went through a short period of being coddled too. At the time, I liked the surface comfort of being coddled, but hated the deep sense that it wasn’t quite right, quite honest, or real. Here’s the thing for me: it ain’t easy letting go and receiving.. coddling or otherwise. the sense that I have to work hard is just so ingrained. I hope this makes sense.
As for men like this… I’ve experimented, playing the role of their mommy…and it’s soul-crushing.
Whew..Saturn can be a downer!
I remember screaming at my first husband… Sun + 4 planets in Scorpio - his mother was a Scorp too:
“Look! A man gets one mother and that’s all. You mother is going to love you no matter what! She’s going to thing every thing you do is the best thing in the world but guess what? I’M NOT YOUR MOTHER! I AM NOT HER! So if you want your ass kissed I suggest you get your mother’s ass on the phone and leave my ass alone!”
Ha ha ha
“Okay then, Peewee,” he said, grinning. The man was 6′7″… 
Hilarious!!
I can’t stand these types at all, and I’m pretty sure they don’t like me much either. I work with two men like this, and they act totally entitled, won’t do any work at all. What planet do these folks live on where everything is provided for??
I also have Saturn in the 4th, in Libra, and had to work for every single thing too. Every time I stuck my hand out as a kid it went unfilled, so I learned to fill it myself. And frankly it has been a blessing because it has made me self-sufficient and unafraid to do my own work and take care of myself. These mothers who protect their kids from reality really do them a disservice - they’re constantly dependent on others.
I have a lot of good saturn in my chart, I am responsible as hell. But the man I am hung up on has saturn in cancer, and jupiter square saturn, as well as a really debilitated 12th house mars. Yes he is lame. Yes he has mommy issues bigtime, his horribly aspected moon is conjunct his ascendant… it goes on.
My point is he was born this way, just as I was born being the mother in my family, fair or unfair… that is how it is. What about people who need/expect to be taken care of those tendencies will always be there, just the way you better believe I take care of my own shit. So how to look at this? Is it ok to to mommie the chronic babies of the world?
This obiviously is not how I raise my children, all three take care of their biz. and it shows in their charts.
Unless I was dead tired I would have just said to the mom of the kid on the horse ” Hi, we are waiting for a turn. ” and prob. smiled a move or lose it lady type smile.
good topic.
Does any one associate these guys with any particular sign? other than just weak or strong Saturn?
B
Eyeeew. That is groooooosssss.
I can’t stand men like that. My nephew, I fear will turn out like that. He’s only four, but he does act like that. And he is spoiled. I say nothing, of course, because as the aunt, really, there’s no way for me to say anything that will come across right. He is lovely and I love his parents (my sibling and his wife). But, the sense of entitlement that’s being bred is, well, gross. It’s not good to get everything you want. I 100% agree.
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1)I know a man with saturn in cap( and Jupiter sadge He is born on ‘46) He is exactly like You say. That is for Satrn in cap?
2)How I handle that situations? Usually I talk directly with the mother with my best librian approach an my best candorous and optimistic good humour. “Hoy long you think that will take?, both of us are dying here”? Usually the woman feels so emabrrased that leaves her blockage, although the childs is the best mannered and leaves first.(Usually) Whatever, sometimes nathing works.